Posted on 11/30/2006 6:10:14 AM PST by cowboyfan88
and a bit unorthodox...
I am not denying that James and the leaders of the church in Jerusalem told Paul to do that. My point is that not everyone in the church in Jerusalem believed that the law was binding, and even if they did, it was shown to not be the case.
*** My point is that not everyone in the church in Jerusalem believed that the law was binding,***
Where is that in scripture that some from Jerusalem did not do these things? If they were Jewish they had to do them. Remember, this order came from JAMES and the ELDERS, the rulers of the Jerusalem church.
Paul even circumcised Timmothy (1/2 Jew) and Peter, at Antioch, in fear separated himself from the Gentile believers when Jewish Christians came from James.
Examine Scripture and you will see that the church was not monolithic in what they did.
***I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius,***
Some here insist baptism saves. Is Paul saying that he thanks God he saved none except Crispus and Gaius?
***and a bit unorthodox...***
Where? they are Trinitarian in doctrine.
Why don't you ask them?
Because he doesn't like the answer.
I didn't bother reading it. Is believing the earth was created in six days approximately six thousand years ago one of the "truths"?
***Because he doesn't like the answer.***
If this is in reference to post #24, then I will ask the question I always ask.
If Baptism saves, are Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses saved as they believe THE SAME DOCTRINE on baptism as you do.
If not, why not.
From a Catholic POV, Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe the same doctrine we do; for starters, I think they both deny original sin. The Mormons certainly do.
But an even bigger catch is that they both deny the Trinity, so as far as we're concerned, what they do isn't Christian baptism at all.
You seem to be trying to start an argument about a position I don't hold. Fortunately, a Catholic's taken issue with what you've said, so now you can have your fun.
I have answered this before, and you keep bringing it up. You are not interested in having a genuine discussion. You only wish to keep throwing out accusations and seeing what sticks.
***You seem to be trying to start an argument about a position I don't hold. Fortunately, a Catholic's taken issue with what you've said, so now you can have your fun.***
I find it interesting you are on my case. My Geneva bible makes it clear we are not saved by water baptism. It even has a prayer in the back "against the papists and anabaptists.
So-was Calvin wrong in these notes?
***From a Catholic POV, Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe the same doctrine we do;***
I agree with you on all this. I know that the when a protestant converts to the Catholic faith their baptism in that protestant faith, such as Baptist, or Methodist and Presbyterian is accepted by the Catholic church. Mormon and JW baptism is not.
What I am trying to show is ther are certain church groups that will not accept any protestant or Catholic baptism but you must be re-baptized in their own particular church with the proper mindset, by immersion only after you have run down the proper checklist of things you have to do. The followers of the doctrine of Alexander Campbell come immediatly to mind, although there are some others.
Once again, you are misrepresenting the beliefs of members of churches of Christ. We do not follow Alexander Campbell, we follow Christ. And I know of no member of the church of Christ that claims a church of Christ member has to baptize someone for it to be valid.
***How so?***
Calvin and Beza's notes.
Isn't it interesting that all those who translated the KJV used the geneva Bible and were believers in sprinkling, not immersion.( I can't think of any anabaptists on the translating committie but I might be wrong.)
The KJV is the bible of Alex Campbell used.
Would you say that he used a bible translated by what you would term UNSAVED men?
*** And I know of no member of the church of Christ that claims a church of Christ member has to baptize someone for it to be valid.***
Then is Baptist immersion valid for one to be a menber of the C of C?
Baptist baptism is not Biblical baptism. The baptism is done for the wrong purpose. The person who does the baptizing does not matter. However, the reasons for being baptized are important, since they are specified in Scripture.
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