What the Popes Have to Say About Socialism (Ecumenical)

American TFP ^ | 02/24/2010 | Gustavo Solimeo

[Pyro7480]

Catholic ping!

[Pyro7480]

Everyone should e-mail this to their local bishop and to the USCCB.

[DarthVader]

Thanks for the great post and information.

[Juana la Loca]

Nice work!

[Campion]

Superb!

[mbarker12474]

ping mbarker12474 catholic pope comments socialism

[BRK]

Great POST!!

Well these Popes are obviously NOT some of the many Amercican Catholics of whom many seem to think that charity and Government programs are exactly the same thing. I don't know how many times I have heard the Christian charge to help the poor being translated by American catholics as a mandate for "soft" socialism. The Kennedy's come to mind as well as many prominent democrats including Nacy Pelosi.

[ArrogantBustard]

Wow.

Every Pope^* since the concept of socialism appeared on the world scene has condemned it. Yet many Catholics (as well as other Christians) seem to support some socialist policies. The state of Christian catechesis in the West is dreadful.

^*JP I excepted ... he wasn't around long enough.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Thank you ten thousand times. I am bookmarking this to re-use it over and over until the USCCB sincerely re-examines its political premises and repents (or Our Lord comes again, whichever comes first!)

[Matchett-PI]

Encyclical of Pope John XXIII, On Establishing Universal Peace In Truth, Justice, Charity, And Liberty, April 11, 1963

“Man’s personal dignity requires besides that he enjoy freedom and be able to make up his own mind when he acts.

In his association with his fellows, therefore, there is every reason why his recognition of rights, observance of duties, and many-sided collaboration with other men, should be primarily a matter of his own personal decision.

Each man should act on his own initiative, conviction, and sense of responsibility, not under the constant pressure of external coercion or enticement.

There is nothing human about a society that is welded together by force.

Far from encouraging, as it should, the attainment of man’s progress and perfection, it is merely an obstacle to his freedom.”

“Hence, a regime which governs solely or mainly by means of threats and intimidation or promises of reward, provides men with no effective incentive to work for the common good.

And even if it did, it would certainly be offensive to the dignity of free and rational human beings.”

“Consequently, laws and decrees passed in contravention of the moral order, and hence of the divine will, can have no binding force in conscience, since ‘it is right to obey God rather than men.’”

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2287244/posts?page=4#4

3 posted on Wednesday, November 18, 2009 2:25:31 PM by Matchett-PI (”The Role of Government is to Secure Our Liberty, Not to Seize It” ~ Rush 6/26/09)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2389225/posts?page=3#3

[Matchett-PI]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2288576/posts?page=11#11

<>

Pope’s New Encyclical Speaks Against New World Order
Lifesitenews.com ^ | July 8, 2009 | John-Henry Westen
http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/jul/09070812.html

Posted on Wednesday, July 08, 2009 10:54:25 PM by Pope Pius XII
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/2288576/posts

[chuckles]

I agree. This post is right on, on what the view of the Church SHOULD be. However, If it were possible, the author should look at the Church teachings on mixing socialistic policies into almost every government represented with a meaningful Catholic following. Look at the Church's leadership in South America and Central American dictatorships. How does Hugo Chavez get offered the Sacraments in Venezuela? What would happen if the Church refused him and condemned his actions against the people? What you will find is many Bishops either say "Stay out of local politics", or they actually are in favor of the dictators policies. What needs to be explained is when Jesus said to feed and clothe the poor, it meant "the Church", not the government. What treasure do you have telling the poor to fill out some forms at the government office? In many instances, the local Church has actually been involved in the coups that install the murderous dictator. When you hear of a nun or priest that has been murdered, first you have to know the background of the Church in that area before you can draw a conclusion. Many times we find out that the Church supported the thug that was taking over the country, even to the point of gun running and spreading cash. A short trip Googling "Jesuits" will open our minds.

To the point of the pope's opinion of socialism, he also condemns abortion, but the Church allows the Sacraments to Dems in Washington. Each one of which has probably voted to allow murdering babies to continue. If nothing else, they are a member of a political party that has as a plank in it's platform to allow such a thing. I would be interested if the pope has ever addressed THAT issue in his statements. When Pelosi left an audience with the pope, she said the issue wasn't decided. Of course, the Church made a statement that it was most definitely decided, but what happened to Pelosi, ......nada. That's the same thing that has happened to Father Phlager preaching communism in Rev Wrights church. And the same thing that happens to each and every Catholic that espouses socialism or collectivism.....nothing! Until Catholics have to at least agree with Church teachings to be Catholic, we will see that socialist teachings have ALREADY come to the fore in the Church. When the Church begins to expell non believers, maybe Catholics will be confronted with the choice of Jesus, or liberalism, but no more fenceriding lukewarmers. Until then, we will still see the Church supporting dictators that shoot people in the back of the head because they promised to feed the poor by STEALING money from the rich. You can look to El Salvador, Nicagragua, Argentina, Bolivia, and on and on to see the conflict in the Church. I'm sure Hugo Chavez thinks he is as good of a Catholic as anybody in Boston including the Kennedy's, and you know,.....he's probably right.

[DarthVader]

It is because many Catholics are Democrats or liberals first and Christians second. The poison of liberation theology has put blinders on their eyes and discernment.

[kitkat]

Excellent! Thank you for researching this.

[the_conscience]

Is there a prescribed method of discipline in the Roman Church?

[chuckles]

To tell you the truth, I don't know. I thought I knew some stuff, but have been disappointed so much and had my head chewed off for what I thought, you probably should ask someone else. When a person completely goes against the Church, they seem to have no action taken and still receive all benefits of the Church.

Having said that, I'll bet there is a prescribed method of discipline, but it isn't being enforced. If we pushed the issue, I'll bet there would be a schism over what to do. Many in our pews today support Obama, abortion, homosexual marriage, women priests, ect. Some Churches have denied The Eucharist to Kerry and others, only to retreat to another Church and receive it. The Bible is clear on Church discipline, but I've not seen any except for some excommunications. What is the threshold for such an action? Is it delivered consistently? Why does one get it and others not? I'm sure the public would howl that the Inquisition has returned.

I'm just saying that if you are public with your views that abortion should be legal, homosexual marriage should be legal, women should be priests, and on and on, we see nothing happens to them, and some are even honored, aka Kennedy.

A split in the Church, IMHO, is coming. Many pooh pooh that and attack me for bringing it up, but the hypocrisy and weakness in the Church is sticking out like a sore thumb. For me, this is a cancer that has been growing for decades and is coming to critical mass( no pun intended). The inability for the Church to handle the pedophile priests in a timely and public manor is just one example. They allowed it to fester and get worse just by pretending there is no problem.

[the_conscience]

Thank you for your honest assessment. Keep fighting, brother.

[Campion]

How does Hugo Chavez get offered the Sacraments in Venezuela?

Do you have any evidence that he does? I looked for it and couldn't find it. He's been divorced twice.

What would happen if the Church refused him and condemned his actions against the people?

In 2005, the Cardinal Archbishop of Caracas said that Chavez "needed an exorcism" and complained about Chavez's treatment of dissidents. In response, Chavez said that the Cardinal was a demon.

The relationship between the Church and Chavez isn't exactly what I'd call a happy one.

[Campion]

Is there a prescribed method of discipline in the Roman Church?

Google "Code of Canon Law". The specific canon you're interested in is # 915.