Testimony of a Former Irish Priest

BereanBeacon.Org ^ | Richard Peter Bennett

[Judith Anne]

I don’t think Christ “relentlessly” went to scripture either. Just a few instances; one where he read from the either the Septuagint or the Hebrew scriptures to the synagogue, in answer to the devil when He was tempted in the wilderness, and when he tossed the moneychangers out of the temple.

And then the “You have heard it said...but I say,” when he was talking about Mosaic law, concerning divorce, killing, etc. But that’s not tradition, that’s about writing the law on our hearts, about giving His law.

[Recovering Ex-hippie]

You just throw stuff out...
“Catholics on this thread...” do this or that...
No wonder they are confused.

how about you just worry about your faith and when your arguments are not very convincing, don’t go trashing Catholics or making assumptions.

Most ex Catholics are pretty angry about the Church..so what else is new?

[jokar]

Catholic knows truth

[Judith Anne]

Someone posted those Scriptures. I forget what thread.

Oh, you have to go check. Well, I was just culling from my memory of the Gospels. I guess the Gospels aren't that familiar to everyone. We WERE talking about Christ saying "It is written" being authoritative, right?

[Iscool]

As in the exegesis of the Bread of Life discourse, the accounts of the Institution of the Sacrament of His Body and Blood, and of this passage, one must remember than a significant tool in the non-Catholic hermeneutical armory is "He didn't really mean that."

I don't know where you would get that idea from...Was Jesus talking about being present in the 'body' or in the Spirit???

But note also, no one in those small groups calls Jesus down from heaven...Jesus shows up on His own...

No one gets out a Eucharistic Ouija board and summons Jesus to come down and then to turn into a cracker so He can be eaten...

Jesus NEVER said to turn a cracker into MY flesh...

[Recovering Ex-hippie]

How totally angry and attacking. wow..the word must have missed your heart.

[boatbums]

Curious conversation with my Mom this past Sunday. I had taken her to Mass as usual and on the trip home, we were talking about her dislike of the Sunday evening service's music choices and volume. She thinks it is too loud and too much like a "rock concert". She especially dislikes it after she receives communion because she said she likes to pray and contemplate the Eucharist in peace. I asked her if she couldn't go somewhere quieter after she receives communion - like the alcove or outside the sanctuary? She responded that she prefers to stay in the sanctuary because that is where the "Holy Presence" is.

I said, "Well, didn't you just receive the host, and don't you have the real presence with you wherever you go?". She didn't answer that.

I appreciate your thoughtful response, Mad Dawg. As you may see, though, it did not do a great deal to dispel the questions. I have to agree your answer may say "No" but it sure sounds like it should be "Yes".

[small voice in the wilderness]

"This do in remembrance of me".

Perhaps a Christian has been feeling ineffectual in his witness of Christ, for any number of reasons. We aren't perfect, we are saved. And as long as we are in our human bodies, we aren't going to be perfect.

[don-o]

Matthew 18:20 says Christ is with believers spiritually. I don't see Him standing in front of you. A believer's renewed mind can conceptualize His spiritual presence in his life, just as Scripture tells us.

A few chapters later in the same gospel, we find:

26:38 "...Lord, when saw we thee hungry..."
26:40 and Jesus said, "Insamuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethern, ye have done it unto me."

Seems like Jesus was saying that He might be found in the most unexpected places.

[Mad Dawg]

I said, "No." I gave a development of the answer. What more do you want?

The quote from the CCC does not say it is necessary or required. As I said, it is BEST.

Does RC teach that the Eucharist helps a person attain eternal salvation?

THAT's not the question originally asked. THAT is not fair. If you ask a question and I answer it it is not reasonable to complain because I did not answer some other question.

I meant what I said to, I think it was boatbums, but I'm not sure. "When you drive to DC do you use a car or the highway?" Do I need to develop that? I will if you like.

Does the Church require Catholics to receive holy communion at least once a year during the Easter season?

As I said, yes.

Is it a mortal sin to disobey this commandment of the Church?

The mere act is not enough to make it a mortal sin. In any event it is not a mortal sin for a non-Catholic, because a non-Catholic is properly bound by the discipline of his group, conventicle, coven, gaggle, hive, ashram, reading room, temple, dojo, or club house -- not by ours.

If someone has been told that object in his hand is a fragment of glass, there is not much blame if he casts it away. If however he has every reason to know it's a diamond, then there is probably some blame.

For it to be a mortal sin for a Catholic he would have to know it was a precept, he would have to choose without constraint to break it, he would have to have some sense of what he was doing. Neglect, ignorance, absent-mindedness, while sometimes serious in themselves, would keep that particular ommission from being mortal. You get "docked" for slugging the body in the chops only if you did it on purpose.

What ABOUT worship of the Eucharist? I hold and really believe that Jesus is truly there in every important sense. Consequently I make my profoundest bows to the exposed Sacrament, because I mean them to be made as a gesture of gratitude, love, and worship to Jesus Himself.

One reason I am grateful for His sacramental presence is that I believe He is with me always even unto the end of the age. But I cannot spend my entire life prostrated. I gotta pay the bills and argue on Free Republic!

So His sacramental presence give me an opportunity to do nothing but love Him and express my love. HERE, at last, is a place where I can press my head to the floor (with the unfortunate consequence of sticking my ample behind up in the air -- which must be a temptation to the toes of the boots of others in the room) to tell Him what He means to me. It is a kind of relief, finally to have some place where I can do what would be hugging tightly if it were my wife or my child.

BTW, my usual practice, when I go to "adore" is to make many prayers to Jesus and to pray my rosary. Then, because I think I serve Him best by cultivating my theological learning, I read in some book on theology or Philosophy. But sometimes, for a change, I will practice what we call "lectio divina". If you don't know what that is, I will happily explain. But few things beat the Word in the presence of the Word.

But, the original question was on the order of "necessary" or "required". Clearly I not only think it's good, I think it's FABULOUS! I cannot say enough about the whole experience and practice of the Mass. It is one big love song, and not only for my sweet Jesus, but, at least in my heart, for all the people worshipping with me. I want to kiss them all, by the time I'm done, especially the ones who are, um, less than entirely delighted with me.

Jesus! My loving, suffering, triumphant, and beautiful Lord! As close to me as one can get this side of paradise! Me a part of Him, He a part of me! What, before the great death which is only entry to the great Life, could be better?

But one of the things I love Him for is that HE is not bound by the Sacraments and he will have mercy on whom He will have mercy.

(Having answered this, I will go back to your earlier post.)

[Iscool]

Many of the anti-Catholics are either unable or unwilling to tell us in the broadest terms (i.e. Methodist, Baptist, etc.) what denomination they belong to.

Denominations don't matter...We are in unity as Jesus desired...If I am a Baptist today and a Methodist tomorrow, doesn't change a thing...

My relationship is with Jesus, not a church...The Body does not control the Head...The HEad controls the Body...

[Judith Anne]

Here now, keep up. In post 610, mm said to MD,

***************************************************

“Tell us where in the Bible that we are told to take the tradition of men on equal standing with the Word of God.

Every time Jesus encountered that mindset, He condemned it and responded with *It is written....*.

*********************************************************

So, if you catch up with the intervening posts, it may help.

I LOVE scripture, with some exceptions, I just don’t worship the Bible. Do you?

[Mad Dawg]

Tell us where in the Bible that we are told to take the tradition of men on equal standing with the Word of God.

I will answer that when you tell me where in the Bible it says the tradition of the Body of Christ is the tradition of men.

Thanks for asking. I slept lousily, which is why I am less than my usual sweet self (I AM usually sweet, right? RIGHT? I .. Said .. RIGHT?) but we messed with the meds, so maybe tonight will be mo' better. Bless you for asking. As I lie on my back tonight, studying the inside of my eyelids, I will comfort myself with thoughts of my adversary car9ing and praying for me.

For the love of God is broader//Than the measure of man's mind.

[don-o]

Thank you. How about II Corinthians 13:5 - "Examine yourselves, whether you are in the faith...

How can there be any question of that after one has been saved? If saving faith has been exercised that one time, I thought the belief is that you were in, always in and never, ever again out? Am I missing something?

[Dr. Eckleburg]

No, He’s repeating the Golden Rule.

[don-o]

He’s repeating the Golden Rule.

Why does He make it so specifically about Him - not just once, but twice?

[don-o]

If I am a Baptist today and a Methodist tomorrow, doesn't change a thing..

Pretty dismissive of the people who thought matters of truth important enough to form bodies to more perfectly reflect their own beliefs. Astounding, actually.

[boatbums]

Where else? I've been looking through the KJV, just don't find it anywhere else in the NT, particularly when He was countering some tradition.

A quick search on the phrase "It is written":

Matthew 11:10
For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee. Matthew 11:9-11 (in Context) Matthew 11 (Whole Chapter)

Matthew 21:13
And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves. Matthew 21:12-14 (in Context) Matthew 21 (Whole Chapter)

Matthew 26:24
The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born. Matthew 26:23-25 (in Context) Matthew 26 (Whole Chapter)

Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad. Matthew 26:30-32 (in Context) Matthew 26 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 1:2
As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee. Mark 1:1-3 (in Context) Mark 1 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 7:6
He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. Mark 7:5-7 (in Context) Mark 7 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 9:12
And he answered and told them, Elias verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought. Mark 9:11-13 (in Context) Mark 9 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 9:13
But I say unto you, That Elias is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him. Mark 9:12-14 (in Context) Mark 9 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 14:21
The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born. Mark 14:20-22 (in Context) Mark 14 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 14:27
And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered. Mark 14:26-28 (in Context) Mark 14 (Whole Chapter)

Luke 2:23
(As it is written in the law of the LORD, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord;) Luke 2:22-24 (in Context) Luke 2 (Whole Chapter)

Luke 3:4
As it is written in the book of the words of Esaias the prophet, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight. Luke 3:3-5 (in Context) Luke 3 (Whole Chapter)

Luke 7:27
This is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee. Luke 7:26-28 (in Context) Luke 7 (Whole Chapter)

Luke 19:46
Saying unto them, It is written, My house is the house of prayer: but ye have made it a den of thieves. Luke 19:45-47 (in Context) Luke 19 (Whole Chapter)

Luke 24:46
And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: Luke 24:45-47 (in Context) Luke 24 (Whole Chapter)

John 6:31
Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat. John 6:30-32 (in Context) John 6 (Whole Chapter)

John 6:45
It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me. John 6:44-46 (in Context) John 6 (Whole Chapter)

John 12:14
And Jesus, when he had found a young ass, sat thereon; as it is written,

Then what Jesus said about "tradition":

Matthew 15:1-3
Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,
Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. Matthew 15:5-7 (in Context) Matthew 15 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 7:3
For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders. Mark 7:2-4 (in Context) Mark 7 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 7:5
Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands? Mark 7:4-6 (in Context) Mark 7 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 7:8
For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. Mark 7:7-9 (in Context) Mark 7 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 7:9
And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition. Mark 7:8-10 (in Context) Mark 7 (Whole Chapter)

Mark 7:13
Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

[boatbums]

Peter also had something to say about tradition.

1 Peter 1:17-18

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear: Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

[metmom]

Most ex Catholics are pretty angry about the Church..so what else is new?

Actually, not. I've known plenty of ex-Catholics and there's no anger. Or bitterness. Or hatred.....

They've been forgiven and they forgive.

But if it makes you feel better to think that ex-Catholics walk around with a chip on their shoulder, by all means, feel free to do so.