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To: LouAvul

Prohobitions against drinking alchoholic beverages are unscriptural. There are numerous passages that reprove drunkenness, but none that prohibit alchohol for laymen or deacons, only elders.

The Bible is emphatic that man is not to add to Scripture, i.e., to make up his own laws that are contrary to Scripture. Not only in the New Testament, but throughout the Old Testament we see this illustrated. God makes it incredibly clear that it is his law we are to obey, and our civil laws are to be compatible with Scripture.

Theologically the prohibition on drunkenness is related to the fact that the person who is drunk loses control of his inhibitions; the drink is controlling his mind and actions. A person who is drunk is unable to prevent themselves from speaking and acting contrary to Scripture. That situation is inconsistent with the Holy Spirit which dwells within believers, as it guides their thoughts, feelings and actions towards obedience to the Word of God and it gives them help in overcoming temptation. The habitual drunkard would really have to question their own salvation, i.e., whether the Holy Spirit dwelled within them, if they are unable to control their consumption of alcohol. Drunkenness, like all other sinful behavior, contradicts the Christian walk. When I habitually engage in a sinful behavior, I know that I have wandered off the straight and narrow path to salvation and I need to get right with God.

The Arminian errors came to pervade many protestant denominations; in America in the 1800’s this resulted in the roots of prohibition. Some women who were wealthy and had presumably too much time on their hands helped to foster the prohibition movement. The concept of prohibition spread to women throughout society and in many congregations; it became very popular. It’s easy to see how they would see habitually drunk lower class men as a problem for society, but they failed to understand that the drunkenness was a symptom, not a root cause. Many men also bought into the idea of prohibition, to be sure, but it was a movement largely springing from the powerful influence of society women.

How should this erroneous thinking been avoided ? Teaching elders, or pastors, are clearly defined in the Bible as men, not women. Therefore the first error was when pastors started listening to popular opinion regarding correct interpretation of Scripture. Preachers should have spoken out againts it and used church discipline to stop people from publicly spreading false teachings. Public drunkenness was addressed in civil law all over America in those days and these laws should simply have been continued to be used. While the “society ladies” could have focused their efforts on moderation, they instead haughtily thought themselves able to cure the problem of drunkenness completely, thinking that it was the alcohol itself that was the problem. They failed to see that the only way sinful behavior in man is restrained is when a person is born again of water and the Spirit, i.e., they convert; they come to God through belief in Jesus Christ. Making alcohol unavailable to the unbeliever who still continues to reject God offers no restraint to their sinful tendencies.

The fact that prohibition was misguided was born out by the the rise of bootlegging and speakeasies and made the crime syndicates that operated them much larger businesses - and more powerful - in America than they had before prohibition.

It is very important to not interpret the Bible as to add to Biblical law, to create additional laws of our own devices and present them as divinely inspired. It never works out well. Teaching elders have a duty to preach the true Gospel, all elders have the duty to use Church discipline in cases of heresy and the whole Church has a duty to stand against sin and testify to the Gospel.


37 posted on 12/19/2011 11:16:59 PM PST by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves.)
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To: PieterCasparzen

“It is very important to not interpret the Bible as to add to Biblical law, to create additional laws of our own devices and present them as divinely inspired. It never works out well. Teaching elders have a duty to preach the true Gospel, all elders have the duty to use Church discipline in cases of heresy and the whole Church has a duty to stand against sin and testify to the Gospel.”

BUMP.

Well said. And I would add not only should we not add to Biblical law, we should not take away from it.


73 posted on 12/20/2011 9:36:31 AM PST by SharpRightTurn ( White, black, and red all over--America's affirmative action, metrosexual president.)
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To: PieterCasparzen
There are so many things wrong with your post, I'm not sure where to begin.

1) Man was given dominion over the earth and authority to make laws. There is no scriptural law that we must drink alcohol, so a human law prohibiting alcohol is not contrary to God's law or scripture. So your whole argument about heresy and false teachings are completely irrelevant.

2) Your third paragraph makes it sound like you believe you can lose your salvation. That's not the case. You can cause God to chastise you, but once you claim that promise, your salvation depends on God and God alone. By Grace are ye saved and not by works. That's why Paul is able to save "Neither life nor death nor...etc...can separate us from the Love of God." Paul is not worried about screwing up.

3) Although the liberal Hollywood and media have chosen to focus on the rise in organized crime, the truth is that many wonderful things also happened during the prohibition era. Church attendance per capita reached an all time high. Hospital admissions dropped by over half. Mental Hospital admissions dropped by over 3/4's. The period was known as "the roaring 20's", a phenomenal economic explosion took place. You're only getting half the story on the prohibition era, you should educate yourself sometime.

4) Your argument that "the only way sinful behavior is constrained is when a person is born again" is clearly false. We have many laws that are quite effective at restraining sinful behavior. Example: Laws against polygamy have practically ended the practice. Laws against murder or theft restrain many people but not all people. You seem to be confusing a person's sinful state with sinful behavior. Behavior can certain be constrained and deterred by human laws. A person's sinful state before God is only dealt with by being forgiven but specific behaviors can certainly be deterred by man's laws.

81 posted on 12/20/2011 11:19:01 AM PST by DannyTN
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To: PieterCasparzen
but none that prohibit alchohol for laymen or deacons, only elders.

Actually, that's incorrect. 1 Tim 3:6 refers to deacons and says, "not given to much wine." KJV. They're not forbidden from drinking. They're forbidden from drinking much wine.

As far as elders, the Greek actually says he must not "stay near wine." A drunkard will "stay near booze" so as to stay drunk. "Staying near wine" is actually how Strong's Greek/Hebrew Dictionary translates it.

Sometimes we get distracted by erroneous, but well meaning, translations. Sort of like the word "Easter" in Acts 12:4 in the KJV. (The word is actually "passover," not Easter.)

87 posted on 12/20/2011 12:04:58 PM PST by LouAvul
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