• It’s obvious the *last days* prophecy referred to in Joel was fulfilled in Acts 2. Uhhhhhh . . . depends on what one means by “fulfilled.” Acts2 was the INTRO, the BEGINNING of the CHURCH ERA.
Acts 2 and Paul in I Cor 12-14 are indicating what is expected to be normative for Christian life and witness IN THE CHURCH ERA.
We now have the Holy Spirit indwelling the hearts of believers everywhere since He has been poured out on us. I don’t think that that can be used to justify the claims of the apparent sudden rash of signs and wonders people are claiming.
I don’t know that the authentic ministry and manifestations of Holy Spirit NEED justification, per se.
I don’t know what you mean by a “sudden rash of signs and wonders.” Signs and wonders have been going on from well before John Wimber and will be continuing to escalate in frequency and dramatic flavor up to the end.
GOD IS NOT ABOUT TO leave all the fireworks to satan.
How could anyone think that God Holy Spirit begins dramatically in Acts 2 and ends DURING THE MOST CLIMACTIC TIME IN THE HISTORY OF ALL CREATION with a
And I hate to have to qualify it also, but that does NOT mean I don’t think they happen. It’s just that I don’t think they happen to the degree that many people claim. I think there’s a real lack of discernment about when it’s genuine and when it’s not that’s the problem.
OF COURSE discernment is needed.
Yet, y’all seem to make it sound like DISCERNMENT is ONLY needed with dramatic manifestations ostensibly of Holy Spirit’s doing.
Nonsense. There’s plenty of discernment needed at the frozen chosen congregations by the dozen. Do you actually believe that such ministers ONLY get the Holy Spirit stuff wrong? LOL.
Folks who refuse to hear Holy Spirit about gifts of The Spirit get a lot of things wrong. And, even when they get a lot right, there’s plenty of spiritual self-righteousness; organizational idolatry and the like . . . plenty stuff to need discernment about.
What confuses me a bit is . . . the operation of the gifts of Holy Spirit tends to attract tons of assaults from satan’s crew as well as their allies in denominations hostile to such. What on earth are folks who supposedly BELIEVE in Holy Spirit’s work in this era throwing so many rocks at such operations?
Have the RC’s & Replacementarians et al taken a vacation from their rock throwing that we need to start throwing rocks at ourselves?
Sigh.
And folks who refuse to hear the Holy Spirit inspired Holy Scriptures about their "favorite" gift tend to also get other doctrines wrong, too. Why is there such a fierce defense of tongues? Even to the point of accusing fellow Christians - who agree on ALL the major tenets of the Christian faith - as being pawns of Satan or in league with the enemies of Christ? There is something strange going on whenever this one issue is in dispute and it tells me that those caught up in it are held hostage by their experiences.
When I spoke about judging experiences by Scripture rather than the other way around, what I so earnestly wanted to communicate is that, no matter what our experiences are, are we able to stand back from them and see them objectively in the light of God's word? Apparently, some can't. If someone claimed to have the gift of healing, wouldn't their experiences prove to them and others if, that was indeed their gift, it was genuine? Now, I know that alleged "faith healers" have fabricated and faked healings in order to dupe supporters but, if I came to them for physical healing from, say, blindness, wouldn't I know if I had truly been healed? If I could go from darkness to clear vision because of their laying hands upon me, then I could verify that had happened. Yet, how many of these charlatans have huge "revivals" and tent meetings and people line up 2 blocks long to be healed and they go away disheartened because they went away no better than they came? Their faith is blamed for why they weren't healed instead of who really is to blame - the false teacher giving false hope.
Why is it that these same teachers also claim other gifts such as "slaying people in the Spirit", giving them the gift of tongues, "holy laughter" and other things that are nowhere found in Scripture that are showy and heap praise upon the preacher rather than the Lord? In the same way, tongues can be and are used as a badge of spirituality when Paul said it was the least of the gifts and the others should more earnestly be desired. The Corinthians were admonished by Paul because they were doing just that and his corrections to them were NOT to praise them but to get them to see the seriousness of seeking after glory that belongs to God alone.
Will there be an outpouring of the Spirit in the last days? Yes, Scripture says so. But does this mean He will do that in ways that the devil can fake? I do not believe He will. Will the two witnesses and the 144,000 be given supernatural abilities to lead people to the Messiah? Absolutely! But this will not be a time where it will need to be faked in order to convince people simply because it will be REAL! Signs and wonders WILL happen in those last days - to me, that is speaking of the Tribulation - but we are not there yet. And God will not allow Satan to counterfeit his power - it will be impossible for him to do so anyway. Everything Satan ever did was try to imitate God and every time he failed. He will ALWAYS fail. God's gifts are genuine. But they are HIS to give and to remove when their purpose is fulfilled and when he says that certain ones HAVE BEEN, I accept that no matter what my experiences may say.