Posted on 06/20/2014 6:23:47 AM PDT by Weiss White
Once upon a time, the Pope excommunicated the entire country of Scotland. The entire country!!
Being a Scot myself, I am almost insulted by that. As a Protestant, I find it hilarious. Thank God for rum(and Puerto Ricans).
My response to this terrible practice of praying to dead humans is where is their faith. Jesus Christ prre-existed creation. Jesus Christ created the material world. Jesus Christ sacrificed himself for us. Jesus Christ is the Son of God. If he can't be a strong advocate for us no one can.
Don't insult God by praying to dead humans instead of taking everything to God the Father through God the Son.
I didn’t know that! LOL
I started where I started to affirm that we have a similar starting place, not to condescend to you. Frankly, you write like a troll. Which could be why others pretty much gave you short shrift. But I gave the benefit of the doubt that perhaps, as you say, your questions were sincere.
As for answering your question, I did. I was responding to your post 26, where you asked:
“Please forgive my ignorance, but; can't I humbly ask God for His blessing?
“My relationship with Him is personal. It would seem blasphemous to act as if another sinner can provide God's blessing.”
You made no mention in that post of marriage specifically.
So, I answered the actual question that you actually asked in that post.
If you deflect or otherwise gainsay that I answered the more general question, why would I continue on to the more specific question?
sitetest
You perhaps have never seen any of their prayers? I’ll give you just one which is taught to the young to get them into the “groove” of the Catholic faith. Notice who the prayer is to.
A CHILD'S PRAYER TO THE IMMACULATE HEART OF MARY
O Most Holy Virgin Mother,
we listen with grief to the complaints
of your Immaculate Heart
surrounded with the thorns placed therein
at every moment by the blasphemies
and ingratitude of ungrateful humanity.
We are moved by the ardent desire of loving you as Our Mother
and of promoting a true devotion to your Immaculate Heart.
We therefore kneel before you
to manifest the sorrow we feel
for the grievances that people cause you,
and to atone by our prayers and sacrifices
for the offenses with which they return return your love.
Obtain for them and for us the pardon of so many sins.
Hasten the conversion of sinners
that they may love Jesus
and cease to offend the Lord,
already so much offended.
Turn your eyes of mercy toward us,
that we may love God with all our heart on earth
and enjoy Him forever in heaven.
Amen. (http://www.catholicdoors.com/prayers/english5/p03093.htm)
Notice also who they are kneeling before and how many things they have asked Mary to do for them. Oh they are praying to Mary and the Saints and don’t let them tell you they don’t. There are many of their prayers listed online that show them to be disingenuous when they tell you they don’t.
>> But rather they are asking for a strong advocate for their prayers to God.<<
They think there is a better “advocate” than the one we are told is the “only” advocate?
Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
I think dissing Christ and thinking someone else can do it better isn’t going to work out well for them.
We are told to go directly to the Father in Jesus name.
Ephesians 5:20 Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;
I don't know. Sigh. Never mind.
Is there a Catholic out there that can explain why I should seek God's blessing from another sinner, rather than from God Himself?
I want to interject, as a Catholic, that it is absolutely true that we pray to Mary and the Saints and all this wishy washy nonsense about only asking them to pray for us is ridiculous and I wish my co-religionists would knock it off.
Once your daughters husband converts to Catholicism through the sacrament of Baptism, they both will be free to remarry each other in the Catholic Church as long as there were no previous marriages. If there were previous marriages, the marriages would have to be nullified or annulled by the Church. Convalidation is usually done when there is a Catholic and non-Catholic union. The Church “recognizes and validates” the marriage union of the Catholic and non-Catholic spouses leaving the Catholic spouse in good standing with the Church... free to practice his/her faith.
And that is exactly what they are doing by praying to Mary and the Saints. And their denial about praying to them is really lame with all the contrary evidence.
While it is true that I am not a Catholic, like you they are my brothers in Christ.
I will not join you in painting them as propagandists.
My apologies. No disrespect was intended. That is how a life-long Catholic explained it to me.
What you describe is blasphemous in an Old Testament manner.
Finally a Catholic who is honest about who they pray to. Thank you for that. I am curious however as to why you would go against what Christ told us to do.
If that is true you would join us in correcting them when they are in error as we are told to do in scripture.
No. The scripture has assigned far more important duties to me. But, good luck with that.
I would, however, truly like to understand them better. As you can see on this thread, they are unwilling/unable to be better understood. Although a bit gruff, only Legatus speaks straightforward.
No apology necessary.
That is how a life-long Catholic explained it to me.
I'm not surprised and that's what drives me crazy. It is true that in many prayers (eg, the Litany of the Saints) the saints are indeed asked to pray for us. But by far most prayers "to the saints" are (for lack of a better term) to the saints. Here's a list of prayers that are common among Catholics, the majority are to God but you should find several that are to specific "saints" (a word which means "holy" btw and we are all called to Holiness).
What you describe is blasphemous in an Old Testament manner.
According to the Jews so is the entirety of the Christian religion.
It took me a bit to realize that you thought I was referring to you when I told my co-religionists to knock it off. I was talking to my fellow Catholics, I should have made that clearer.
Can you explain why I should seek God's blessing from another sinner, rather than from God Himself?
(as presented in the article)
It is OK if you don't know. I don't know either.
I see you quote me.
But you quote two sentences of mine separated by a bunch of other sentences, and thus, remove them from their original context and meaning.
Even without the benefit of and ellipsis (a technique used by the woefully dishonest).
The fact is, I gave you an answer to your first question. You just didn't like it.
Yep. Troll.
sitetest
Ugh, now I have to go read an article about canon law lol... hang on.
My relationship with Him is personal. It would seem blasphemous to act as if another sinner can provide God's blessing.
This looks like the place to start:
Your relationship with God may be personal, but it's not exclusive, you have to sully yourself with the rest of us sinners. Your question goes to the heart of the issue of whether Our Lord established a Church or not. If He did then everything that Catholicism teaches follows.
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