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To: Partisan Gunslinger
Sounds like you don't really understand the Church, but have bought into lies some people like to spread about the Church.

"To be a Catholic you must put your trust in a man other than Jesus to represent God. That is the same thing liberals do, they put their trust in governments, celebrities, etc, to be as God rather than God Himself."

By no means. Assuming that you refer to the Catholic priest acting In Persona Christi as commanded by God in 2 Corinthians, its a rather insane jump to go from their to saying that Catholics are equivalent to big-gov liberals.

"Also to be a Catholic, you must be against individualism. Catholics reject the protestant belief of each individual having a relationship to God."

Absolutely false. The Catholic Church does not reject each person having a relationship with God, which is NOT a Protestant belief anyway. Individualism, in a general sense, is the opposite of socialism, and the Church considers socialism is a heresy. It was definitively established by Pope Leo XIII in Rerum Novarum that the right to private property must be inviolable. The Catholic Church opposes moral individualism, in which every person is free to make up their own truth.

"Catholics say each person needs to be subject to the Catholic Church or to the pope or to Mary to let those entities be the mediator to God."

Christ established the Catholic Church, the rock He built on Peter. So yes, you do need to be subject to it. I am extremely grateful to be subject to Christ who, per Catholic dogma, the sole mediator between God and man.

"Catholics reject individual opinion. I know as a protestant that there is no one on earth that believes the same as I on every subject of Christianity. There are some Christians that I share beliefs with that I will agree with 99% of the time."

So, you're a relativist? Again, there cannot be two truths. There is only one absolute, objective truth -- and while it may be temporarily comforting to have a buffet of supposed"truths" to choose from, that one objective truth does not change.

"Imagine if that same were true of politics, that everyone must be in full agreement all the time or there will be punishment."

Religion is not politics. There are many issues, such as capital punishment, form of government, etc, that Catholics can in good conscience hold different opinions on.

"That's why some of us see Catholicism as opposed to liberty, we should have the liberty to disagree, whether it be the nature of Christianity, or the nature of politics."

I see Protestants as opposed to liberty then -- we should have the liberty to disagree on whether saints can intercede with Christ on our behalf, for example. But Protestants just won't play ball.

"But apply the ways of Catholicism to our government and freedom is lost."

No offense meant, but this sentence clearly reveals your ignorance of Church teachings. Look up subsidiarity.

51 posted on 08/16/2014 7:01:56 PM PDT by Wyrd bið ful aræd (Asperges me, Domine, hyssopo et mundabor, Lavabis me, et super nivem dealbabor.)
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd
Christ established the Catholic Church, the rock He built on Peter.

Christ's rock was the church and the church was sent out through the 12 apostles, not just Peter. And Peter never went to Rome. Christ said the gates of hell shall not prevail over His church. It's pretty clear that the forces of evil got the best of the church of Rome, with all it's heresies, it's gall of bitterness, it's bond of iniquity. It's a church of pedophilia, the evil acts of the Jesuits, the alliance with freemasonry since Vatican 2, it's embrace of socialism since Pope Pius 12, the abduction, gang rape, and murder in the Vatican itself of the teenage girl Emanuela, we could go on and on.

So yes, you do need to be subject to it. I am extremely grateful to be subject to Christ who, per Catholic dogma, the sole mediator between God and man.

Then why call the pope "Father", which is forbidden in the bible? Why call him the vicar of Christ?

So, you're a relativist? Again, there cannot be two truths.

There is only one truth, and Christ was the only man who held to that truth. The rest of us are not perfect in wisdom as Christ was. It is the goal of the rest of us to get as close to that truth as we can, and then we will be judged on our attempts to do just that. All it takes is effort, God judges on effort, since none of us will achieve perfect truth and wisdom in the flesh. When you allow the Catholic Church to decide what truth and wisdom is for you, you are putting almost no effort in the pursuit of it. You're letting imperfect men take the place of the Word.

There is only one absolute, objective truth -- and while it may be temporarily comforting to have a buffet of supposed"truths" to choose from, that one objective truth does not change.

And the Catholic Church is much farther than most protestants from that perfect truth.

Religion is not politics. There are many issues, such as capital punishment, form of government, etc, that Catholics can in good conscience hold different opinions on.

You think the pope is going to appreciate differeing from him on capital punishment?

I see Protestants as opposed to liberty then -- we should have the liberty to disagree on whether saints can intercede with Christ on our behalf, for example. But Protestants just won't play ball.

Protestants don't punish people on having disagreements. It's why there are so many different protestant churches. It's what narses always posts that yopios (or whatever) picture making fun of the fact that protestants hold different opinions. I see difference of opinion as a strength. It's what America was built on, each individual voting his/her opinion and coming together on the big stuff. Catholics have a history of punishing people for having difference of opinion as in the inquisition, the genocides (that some freepers celebrate), etc.

Regarding the rest of your post, the fruits of Catholicism don't match what you say. Catholics support Obama, your popes celebrate Islam, Francis embraces socialism, puts down Reagan and conservatives, embraces moral relativism, says we should not spread the Word of God, again, I could go on and on. I judge by fruits, as the bible says, and as Peter himself told Simon Magus in Samaria, you are the gall of bitterness and the bond of iniquity. That was a prophecy, and indeed when Simon Magus' followers took over the church of Rome that Paul started, that's exactly what the Catholic Church became.

52 posted on 08/17/2014 6:39:19 AM PDT by Partisan Gunslinger
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