Posted on 10/31/2014 4:56:55 PM PDT by Gamecock
Full Title: Pope Francis 'called us his brother bishops,' says Protestant pastor from Mobile, who lunched, swapped caps with the pontiff
MOBILE, Alabama - First, the pope does not want his ring kissed. And he prefers to be called Father Francis rather than Your Holiness.
Those were some of the marching orders given to Rev. Henry W. Roberts II of Mobile and other bishops with the Communion of Evangelical Episcopal Churches, who met with Pope Francis at the Vatican Oct. 10. The CEEC is an international ecumenical network that strives for unity among all Christians.
"He looks like one of the fellas. He's so down to earth," said Roberts, describing a photo he took with the pope during the visit. Roberts is founding pastor of Word of Life Community Church, an interdenominational congregation of 1,500 with locations in Chickasaw and Whistler. A graduate of McGill-Toolen Catholic School, he has been a bishop with the CEEC network since 2007.
Roberts said one of the bishops asked the pontiff if he would bless them to go and proclaim the miracle of unity. "He said, 'I can't really bless you, because we're brother bishops.' He actually called us his brother bishops," he said.
Roberts said the group met with Pope Francis for more than an hour and shared lunch in his private dining room at Casa Santa Marta, his Vatican residence. The main topics at the meeting, which occurred during the recent Synod, were family and Christian unity.
"He said, No. 1, that we as believers, as Christians, have to stop talking bad about each other and being condescending," Roberts recalled. "No. 2, we need to find a good Catholic that we can just fellowship with and develop a relationship with."
Roberts also exchanged a skull cap called a zucchetto with the pontiff. He had purchased the white hat made especially for Francis in Rome to make the swap. "I loved his personality, and I could feel his heart and compassion for people and his love for people," he said. "I know he's sincere about seeing people come together."
The meeting with the CEEC bishops, which was videoed and is on YouTube, shows the pope speaking through an interpreter about the need for unity. "We're always concentrating on the differences," the pope told the group. "We all have the same baptism, and the same baptism is more important than our differences. We all believe in the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit."
The CEEC, considered part of the "convergence movement," drew media attention this year because of a longtime friendship between the pope and CEEC Bishop Tony Palmer of South Africa. Palmer, a Protestant who considered Francis his spiritual father, organized the October meeting before he was killed in a motorcycle accident in August.
The pope famously recorded a seven-minute video on Palmer's iPhone for the bishop to present to a conference by U.S. evangelist Rev. Kenneth Copeland. In the video, which went viral on YouTube, the Pope Francis urges "the miracle of unity" between Protestants and Catholics.
You make a very important point.
Catholics do NOT obey the Pope or listen to his teaching (if any) because of a belief that he was the best man available for the job. They give the Pope respect and obedience because he is the Pope.
In other words, the Pope’s authority has NOTHING to do with confidence in the integrity or the intelligence of the Cardinals.
It has everything to do with the fact that he is Bishop of Rome. I.e., he is a successor of Peter as Bishop of Rome.
The respect given to the Pope is founded on Christ’s words to Peter, NOT confidence in the Cardinals.
No guidance by the Holy Spirit? I believe that to be true but why would anyone rely on that "church" for anything having to do with eternal life? It is pure folly.
The virtues of Faith, Hope, and Charity certainly are GIFTS from the Holy Spirit, but as far as I understand theologically based on scripture, they has nothing to do with the rites of Baptism...
Baptism is a act of faith where the of age believer get immersed in water to symbolically wash away his sins and when pulled above the water symbolically are raised from the dead...from death to life, Christ in new life...
Non-Catholics in many cases have a dedication service for infants asking the parents and the congregation to be dedicated to raising their child in the admonition of the Lord...
Are we all not still in the state of original sin, still under the temptation of the flesh, or am I unaware of a Catholic teaching where an infant baptism removes their fallen nature...?
Aw, it's not that bad. I'm sure that no Protestant who interprets Genesis literally will ever be allowed to do such a thing. After all, they think G-d is a "Divine being" who "can do anything."
There are many things the "unchanged one true church" can excuse, but that ain't one of 'em.
Wouldn't that make those bishops "protestant", then??? Not all that different than what Martin Luther, Calvin and other reformers had to decide.
Especially if they admit that the church leadership is not being guided by the Holy Spirit.
Fancy that......
Talk about being caught between a rock and hard place.
Interesting...as if we needed any further proof that the Pope of Rome is NOT the so-called "Successor to St. Peter" as is forcefully asserted by Roman Catholics.
To us that is rather obvious, but it was good for you to affirm it, though i believe you meant the the Cardinals are not guaranteed that they will be guided by the Holy Spirit to make His choice.
The CE expresses its view of a normal election saying,
..one of the cardinals, addressing the assembly, proposes the name of a candidate with the words Ego eligo (I elect, etc.), whereupon all the cardinals, as though moved by the Holy Spirit, proclaim aloud the same candidate, saying Ego eligo, etc. - http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04192a.htm
Which seems to be taken from the Apostolic Constitution of Pope Paul VI:
The first method can be called the method of acclamation or inspiration; it is used when the cardinal electors, as though inspired by the Holy Spirit, freely and spontaneously pro claim one man Supreme Pontiff. ac claiming him unanimously. http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Paul06/p6elect.htm
Fr. Joseph Eddy, O. de M. assured, "Guided by the Holy Spirit, the Cardinals will make the right choice." =- http://greatcatholichomilies.com/2013/02/guided-by-the-holy-spirit-the-cardinals-will-make-the-right-choice/
Bishop J. Strickland states, "The Cardinal Electors guided by the Holy Spirit have chosen a man from the new world, from Argentina." http://bishopstrickland.com/index.php?id=637
"Our Sunday Visitor" asserts,
"How the Church chooses a pope Guided by the Holy Spirit, cardinals gather in the Sistine Chapel and cast secret ballots to elect pontiff." (2/20/2013)
http://www.ecatholicblog.com/pope-resigns likewise states, "Guided by the Holy Spirit, cardinals elect by ballot.."
Finally, the NCR reports,
Perhaps the classic expression of this idea belongs to none other than the outgoing pope, Benedict XVI, who as Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger was asked on Bavarian television in 1997 if the Holy Spirit is responsible for who gets elected. This was his response:
I would not say so, in the sense that the Holy Spirit picks out the Pope. ... I would say that the Spirit does not exactly take control of the affair, but rather like a good educator, as it were, leaves us much space, much freedom, without entirely abandoning us. Thus the Spirit's role should be understood in a much more elastic sense, not that he dictates the candidate for whom one must vote. Probably the only assurance he offers is that the thing cannot be totally ruined. d!
Then the clincher:
There are too many contrary instances of popes the Holy Spirit obviously would not have picked. - http://ncronline.org/blogs/all-things-catholic/quick-course-conclave-101
This is an assumption on your part. And it's false. The ritual of Baptism includes a profession of faith--the Apostles' Creed, as well as the Baptismal Promises.
Actually a confession of faith in the atonement of the blood of Christ is not required by Rome for a baptism which makes one a recipient of the Holy Spirit and a child of God.
Nor can it be shown that those who have received Cath. baptism manifest greater (if any) evidences of regeneration than those who realized evangelical baptism overall.
Which proves that Catholics are not Protestants.
What a bombshell!
He is the successor of Saint Peter because he is bishop of Rome, who was the first bishop of Rome.
How does ANYTHING I said call this proposition into question?
I'll bet of the 13, 12 are married with families...Those 12 are the only ones qualified to be called bishops...
Of course, expressions of some sort of belief that the Holy Spirit is or may be involved are plentiful in history. It may even be true.
Nevertheless, there is NOTHING in the Catholic Church’s teaching about divine guidance or protection of the Conclave. Jesus promised that his Church would not teach error. He said nothing about any analogous guarantee for acts of governance.
As always, Ratzinger is balanced, and makes the necessary distinctions.
I never said that the Church’s leadership is not guided by the Holy Spirit. I said that the Church claims NO GUARANTEE of divine guidance or protection for the conclave. The Church is divinely protected from teaching error. The conclave is not part of that function of the Church.
That “little pebbles” bit is a total fabrication by dishonest anti-Catholic propagandists.
So you excommunicate another RC but whom she counts and treats as a member, as she did and is doing to proabortion, prosodomote promuslim, prooccupy movement Tom Menino.
Except this time it is the pope himself whom you excom, which office RCs tell us we need to look to for interpretation, not your interpretation of who is really a RC.
Oh yes, you can try "did not deny infallible doctrine" plea, but as V2 showed, what they may include and mean can be open to further interpretation, and those RCs who pick and chose what to obey from that are called Protestant by other RCs across the aisle. No problem with interpretation under Rome.
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