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To: imardmd1
I noticed the phrases you used here.

  1. works bring salvation
  2. nothing to do with salvation
  3. inception of salvation
  4. salvation begins

My advice: drop Calvin and believe all the scriptures. Salvation is a journey. Cling to the LORD Jesus Christ and do His works, His commandments, as He commanded. You can find them in the Law of Moses, and on them hang all the Law and the Prophets.

6,428 posted on 01/19/2015 6:24:38 PM PST by af_vet_1981 (The bus came by and I got on, That's when it all began.)
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To: af_vet_1981

....”Cling to the LORD Jesus Christ and do His works, His commandments, as He commanded.”......

We will surely fail under your equation....and frustrate the Grace of God.

Rather...that we let the Lord live ‘His life’ through us, by His Spirit, and walk in Faith.


6,434 posted on 01/19/2015 7:38:52 PM PST by caww
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To: af_vet_1981
Salvation is a journey

Well, like every journey, it has to have a beginning. And the beginning of starts with God seeking you out, as He did Abram, and Nathanael, and inviting you to go on a long, long trip, with Him as the tour director, and no going back. And the ticket is paid for. You only have to meet the requirement of believing in Him, based on His history with others, leaving everything you have behind, as Peter and his fellow fishermen did, including their homes and Moms and Dads.

Now, when the trip labeled Salvation, or in the pre-Christ times Redemption (which is about the same thing), you need to count the cost, for when God saves, it is for ever, and it happens once, at the beginning, for good, with lasting effects.

Before The Law:

"Therefore thus saith the LORD, who redeemed Abraham, concerning the house of Jacob, Jacob shall not now be ashamed, neither shall his face now wax pale" (Isa. 29:22 AV).

Jehovah ordered, Abram believed, and The Lord redeemed. (Gen. 12:1, Heb. 11:9).

"Redeemed" above is in the perfect tense, a action performed, once for all time, with ongoing consequences.

"The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; . . ." (Gen 48:16 AV).

Isaac spoke of The LORD to Jacob, and Jacob hd a dream at Luz, which he naned Bethel. There Jacob belived in Christ, and God saved/redeemed him (Gen. 28:20-22). "Redeemed" here is in the perfect tense. Once completed, with ongoing effects.

Under The Law:

"And David answered Rechab and Baanah his brother, the sons of Rimmon the Beerothite, and said unto them, As the LORD liveth, who hath redeemed my soul out of all adversity," (2 Sam 4:9 AV).

The Lord sent Samuel to anoint David, David responded and was anointed, and the Holy Spirit was upon him thereafter. David was redeemed, and the tense of the verb is the perfect tense. An action, once completed and irrevocable, with lasting results.

"And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace" (Lk. 7:50 AV).

Mary Magdalene showed her faith in the Lord Jesus, and was saved, not by her works, but by her faith.

"Saved" here is in the perfect tense, Jesus saved her ar once, forever, with lasting consequences.

"And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee" (Lk. 18:42 AV).

A blind beggar, in faith, cried out to Jesus passing by, and had faith to trust Jesus to give him site. Jesus saved him on the basis of his faith unaccompanied by any works, and gave him sight.

"Saved" here is in the perfect tense: an action once for all time completed, with eternal consequences.

Under Grace:

"But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, "Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)" (Eph 2:4-5 AV).

Those who were saved, were dead in sins and absolutely unable to perform any acceptable works toward The God, but he saved them, each individual at once for all time, with everlasting consequences of new birth, new life, and new Lord.

"Saved" here is in the perfect tense.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph 2:8-9 AV).

Referring to the same souls, they are saved by grace and faith apart from any human beneficial (or detrimental) works, penance duties, acts of contrition, etc. because people who are unsaved, who are dead in spirit to The God and His Christ, cannot do anything pleasing for Him. He saaves in spite of what you are, who you are, or what you do., based on crying out in sensible longing faith, "Please save me!"

"Saved" here is in the perfect tense--somthing done once at a point in time, never needing to be repeated, with ongoing and increasing effects.

=============

Are you getting the point?? "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure" (Php 2:12-13 AV).

You can't work out a salvation which is not already yours, permanently, and for all time. Yes God is more often interested in the process, perhaps more than the product. But you can't have a process, which in this case is sanctification, that doesn't start with an initial event, which is the act God performs gratuitously--salvation--the result being having Him as the new and permanent owner and proprietor of this piece of dead meat.

So, lets not hear anything more about penance having anything to do with this redemption, this act of salvation, this change in ownership. The Savior is not interested or impressed with penance, a self-imposed inversely prideful suffering. There's enough unwanted suffering without it, and He's already done more of it for you already than you can comprehend.

6,445 posted on 01/19/2015 9:25:49 PM PST by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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To: af_vet_1981
My advice: drop Calvin and believe all the scriptures. Salvation is a journey.

My advice: drop Rome and believe what JESUS said. Salvation is NOT a journey.

Luke 7:50

"Your faith HAS saved you. Go in peace."

6,452 posted on 01/20/2015 5:40:35 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: af_vet_1981
Cling to the LORD Jesus Christ and do His works, His commandments, as He commanded. You can find them in the Law of Moses, and on them hang all the Law and the Prophets.

I see the blender speed was set on Medium.

6,453 posted on 01/20/2015 5:42:21 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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