None of which can a man comprehend in terms of the entirety of his own mortal existence, because he is in the position of a "moving present" on a linear, serial, irreversible time series of "quantized moments." Only God can see wholeness in a process like this, because he is not a captive of this particular notion of time.
Which is probably as clear as mud....
I've been grappling with time issues lately. I've received major stimulus from the work that MHGinTN has done on this subject. He postulates different (yet not mutually exclusive) time orders designated as planar and volumetric.
For the sake of argument, might I propose that, on my understanding, planar time and volumetric time designate two temporal categories that "do not operate on the same plane." That is to say, the idea of temporal hierarchy is introduced here, in such a way as to suggest that the planar might in some way ultimately prove to be a function of the volumetric.
For insight into planar time, the model I gravitate to is the Cartesian Plane. This is a two-dimensional mathematical construct built on an X- and a Y-axis.
To represent a man's life in terms of a "timeline," we only need the X-axis. It proposes a model of time divided into discrete steps moving irreversibly, serially, linearly, from past to present to future. It is a number line composed of positive and negative real numbers, "divided" by Zero (0) [which is NOT "nothing"] "in the middle." "Humanizing" the number line on X, we have, to the "right" of Zero, the future. To the left, we have the past. Zero itself represents the "present moment" — which likely flows along in wavelike form to someone who can view matters in that perspective. [Which is probably why the Y-axis is so important.]
The problem seems to be "the present moment" — for it is so terribly fleeting. The present moment slides away into the past at the very moment we think of it in the present.
Linear time — the X-axis of planar time — is seemingly the "time" that most human beings sense, almost all of the time, evidently quite naturally. But that would be a predisposition, quality, or qualification, that cannot be explained in terms of linear time. Hence our need to better understand what the Y-axis entails....
Whatever. We haven't even gotten to volumetric time yet — which is NOT confined to two dimensions....
I suspect volumetric time is the matrix into which linear time is nested. Mostly, it is never directly perceived by human beings. Yet my main point here would be: At some logically irreducible level, humans' ability to perceive at all utterly depends on it.
Dear MHGinTN, if I have misunderstood you in any way, I truly would welcome correction from you.
Alamo-Girl, dearest sister in Christ, thank you ever so much for your wonderful insights!
Linear time — the X-axis of planar time — is seemingly the “time” that most human beings sense, almost all of the time, evidently quite naturally. But that would be a predisposition, quality, or qualification, that cannot be explained in terms of linear time. Hence our need to better understand what the Y-axis entails....
Position X, position Y, position Zed... scale X. scale Y, scale Zed... and shape on same three axis.. and the/an extrusion factor..
determines a human’s “reality quotient”.... all different for each one..
Much like a universe with many different “objects”.. all different in unique ways.. and the same in others..
Inhabiting “SPACE”... that is not nothing.. but something “we” know not of.. maybe dark energy/matter..
Speaks to me of the most rare thing I know of............... “humility”..
which is a requirement for conceiving of “GOD”.... even if you don’t believe in one..
for...... all are humble in degrees.. if at all..
***
I have derived my cosmology from what I believe to have been the initial conditions, when dimension space and dimension time became distinctly not ‘the other’. Space would evolve from point (in the point/moment of the started differentiation) to line to plane to volume. But when line is expressed all the points making up that line remain in existence due to their proximity to moment; when linear time expresses all the moments remain in existence making up the linear temporal expression, etc., through plane/planar, etc. I imagine the first expression of the Universe of God’s creation would have been the initial point/moment. I have yet to fathom how the singularity prior to point/moment would be described. To this realm of expressing spacetime ‘coordinates’ God has Added other dimensions with expressing variables. A living organism is made up of organs, which are in turn made up of cells. At some ‘least’ expression we might say the dimension from which life expresses is woven into the spacetime coordinate system. Would we say a prion is ‘alive’?
And thank you two too, dear brothers MHGinTN and hosepipe, for all of your insights!
When considering such issues, I think of the singularity as a mathematical point, that is having no coordinates at all. Spatially speaking, a world of one coordinate would be a line, two a plane, three a cube and so on.
In Everett's multi-world cosmology (actually another interpretation of quantum mechanics) - the wave function never collapses. Schrödinger's cat is both alive and dead. A world exists where I chose bacon for breakfast and another where I chose sausage and so on.
But of course even if such were the structure of dimensional reality, a man only experiences one moment at a time, one after another, serially-sequentially to his cognition. And as you so astutely pointed out, even then he never actually experiences anything in the present due to time elapsing between perception and cognition.
His experience of life I see as a line of moments which appear to him to be causally connected past>present>future. In theories which posit more than one dimension of time, each of those moments always exist concurrently. The man is merely experiencing them in a line.
If we could make a copy of the universe in a moment, it would appear as a plane of time, or more accurately a membrane since space is warped. If we could could do this for all moments in time, like a video but real, it would appear as a volume of time. It would be interesting to page to a particular date and time for an "instant replay."
And if Everett's theory were correct, we'd have that for all potential universes as well, e.g. the universe where I had bacon this morning would also be a volume.
To borrow from Max Tegmark's Level IV Parallel Universe, the mortal man (frog in his article) sees a particle orbiting, but the one above it (bird in his article) sees a strand of spaghetti, i.e. the beginning and end of the particle and all points in between. If the frog sees two particles orbiting, the bird sees two strands of spaghetti twisted in a double helix. The frog himself looks like a bowl of spaghetti to the bird.
Likewise, to God our individual lives are start to finish and all points along the way visible to Him through we are experiencing life serially-sequentially. That will no doubt cause much concern later on:
There will be no hiding place as the old song goes:
~~~~
Dear Sister in Christ, Your mention of "volumetric time" brings to mind our discussions of "The Universal 'Now'".
Since all of our inputs vis-a-vis time are transmitted to us by one form or another of electromagnetic or physical vibrations, we "see" an astronomically distant event as displaced in time by the time required for EM information about it to reach us. (The "C" limitation...)
Only a Being in a totally different dimension (i.e. "God") can see the "simultaneous instantaneous reality" of all points in our universe ( Universal NOW") -- without that distortion that is imposed upon us by "C"...
So, I think we're both tallking about the same thing: "volumetric" or "multidimensional" time -- the perception of which may remain beyond our reach -- as long as we are "bound within" the dimensions of this universe...
We have much to anticipate!