Posted on 03/27/2015 1:04:17 PM PDT by Gamecock
Wow....just. wow.
What do the catholics say in "defense" of this mess?
I concur that the Tetragrammaton or Yehovah or at least Yahweh would be fitting, though you may be aware that when the KJV uses all caps for LORD then it denotes just that.
Yet The Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments (CONGREGATIO DE CULTU DIVINO ET DISCIPLINA SACRAMENTORUM) decreed (June 29, 2008),
1. In liturgical celebrations, in songs and prayers the name of God in the form of the tetragrammaton YHWH is neither to be used or pronounced.
2. For the translation of the biblical text in modern languages, intended for the liturgical usage of the Church, what is already prescribed by n. 41 of the Instruction Liturgiam authenticam is to be followed; that is, the divine tetragrammaton is to be rendered by the equivalent of Adonai/Kyrios; "Lord," Signore, Seigneur, Herr, Señor, etc.
3. In translating, in the liturgical context, texts in which are present, one after the other, either the Hebrew term Adonai or the tetragrammaton YHWH, Adonai is to be translated "Lord" and the [word] "God" is to be used for the tetragrammaton YHWH, similar to what happens in the Greek translation of the Septuagint and in the Latin translation of the Vulgate.
At least they did not forbid owning or reading the Bible on your own without special permission.
Our God has a Name. The Muslims do not share in The Name, YHWH. That settles it for me. So no 'Allah' is NOT YHWH. The Muslims worship a different 'god.'
But Rome rejects calling God YHWH in liturgy, and affirms the god of Islam as its own. And RCs want us to submit to her?!
And which is well substantiated and the differences extend further than that.
Thus Rome is wrong to affirm,
together with us they adore [worship] the one, merciful God , mankind's judge on the last day." ( Lumen Gentium 16, November 21, 1964: CCC 841; Emp. mine)
Yet RCs go into contortions trying to defend it. Just imagine what they would say is the Westminster Confession said that!
“What do the catholics say in “defense” of this mess?”
No defense is necessary. Only the balance:
Whoever knows the Old and New Testaments, and then reads the Koran, clearly sees the process by which it completely reduces Divine Revelation. It is impossible not to note the movement away from what God said about Himself, first in the Old Testament through the Prophets, and then finally in the New Testament through His Son. In Islam all the richness of God’s self-revelation, which constitutes the heritage of the Old and New Testaments, has definitely been set aside. Some of the most beautiful names in the human language are given to the God of the Koran, but He is ultimately a God outside of the World, a God who is only Majesty, never Emmanuel, God-with-us. Islam is not a religion of redemption. There is no room for the Cross and the Resurrection(p. 92).
So, with your post, we’re once again back to:
“To Protestantism False Witness is the principle of propagation. … Taking things as they are, and judging of them by the long run, one may securely say, that the anti-Catholic Tradition could not be kept alive, would die of exhaustion, without a continual supply of fable.” (John Henry Newman, Lecture 4. True Testimony Insufficient for the Protestant View)
Oh, I should point out that the quote I posted “(p.92)” is from Pope John Paul II from the book called Crossing the Threshold of Hope.
They don't, they claim, we can't understand the language as it is too nuanced
- assert Christians do the same
- say we have the wrong catechism
- quote old homos.
You are saying Jehovah and Allah are the same God??
“You are saying Jehovah and Allah are the same God??”
Where do you see that in what I posted?
Where do you see that in what I posted?
It was a question addressed to you...You COULD answer the question...
That's exactly what happened. God said He would be a God to Isaac but never once said He would be a God to Ishmael. The Arabs are descendent of Ishmael. The Jews/Isrealites are descendents of Isaac. Abraham pleaded with God that Ishmael would live before God but God essentially said no.
Genesis 17:18 And Abraham said unto God, O that Ishmael might live before thee! 19 And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
Jewish official prayers start by invoking YHVH, “the God of Abraham”, “the God of Isaac” (as opposed to the God of Ishamael), and “the God of Jacob” (as opposed to the God of Esau).
The question was “do they serve the same god as Muslims”.
“It was a question addressed to you...You COULD answer the question...”
And I answered with a question. If you didn’t see it in what I posted, then don’t suggest I said it or waste my time asking if I said it. If I said it, you wouldn’t have to ask if I said it now would you?
In general, Jewish tradition accepts Islam and Christianity at their word that they intend to worship the infinitely kind personal God who is also the God of creation. To Jews, it probably makes little difference whether professed intent of non-Jews is the same as the practice.
Why do Catholics dance around the issue? Do you worship the same god as Muslims?
No. I don't know what's going on in Rome anymore or where they've gotten the crazy idea that just because Muslims "profess" to worship the God of Abraham means they do, after all they've got the mormons figured out.
I worship the God of traditional Jews. That’s why traditional Jewish prayer pins it down to the God of Abraham AND Isaac AND Jacob; to emphasize taking exception to erroneous conceptions of God.
I believe Christians invoke Jesus or the Trinity to emphasize their taking exception to what they believe are erroneous conceptions of God.
Where do you see that in what I posted?
You never come out and clearly say. Like a lot of catholic answers you dance around the direct question.
Dear Muslims, my brothers: I would like to add that we Christians, just like you, seek the basis and model of mercy in God himself, the God to whom your Book gives the very beautiful name of al-Rahman, while the Bible calls him al-Rahum, the Merciful One.” - John Paul II, address to representatives of Muslims of the Philippines, February 20, 1981
Are Jehovah and Allah the same? Your pope is saying they are.
Like I said: Where do you see that in what I posted?
The correct answer is that I didn’t say it anywhere in the post. I posted what I posted - a post YOU PINGED ME TO - to simply post some balance. You could have done the same thing.
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