Martin Luther’s Definition of Faith

>>Are you claiming that you don't commit any sin?<<

Now where did I say that? Re-read what I said. Here it is. I'll high light the pertinent part so maybe you get it this time.

"So God lied when He said He would forgive our sins and remove them from as far as the East is from the West? You claim He will turn on the promise and bring the sins up again?"

Now, rather then try to divert how about answering the question.

Faith saved him.

That is true but the willingness to do the work showed his faith.

Mathew 22
11 “But when the king came in to see the guests, he saw a man there who did not have on a wedding garment. 12 So he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you come in here without a wedding garment?’ And he was speechless. 13 Then the king said to the servants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, take him away, and[a] cast him into outer darkness; there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

14 “For many are called, but few are chosen.”

The man went to get a free pig out and did not respect the giver enough even to tuck his shirt in or wash his face, that would be too much work.

That is not faith, it is self righteousness.

Who is Jesus talking to??? The church??? Do you see a church anywhere???

Jesus is speaking to Jews, and only Jews, under the law...And what’s the context of the discourse???

You are mistaken on this one.

Jesus was speaking to his 12 apostles.

As you already know and expressed many times. He’s the expiation of our sins. Our only means to reconciliation with the Father. The sole way to Heaven. He who the gates of Hades cannot withstand.

Hence the Resurrection of all and the opportunity for eternal life with God for those willing.

Doesn't have any structure beyond the local church...The assembly of believers with a couple of spiritual leaders...And of course the writings of the O.T. and New...That's it...

Prove it.

Agreed.

Thanks. It should be patently obvious that if you don’t even believe in Jesus Christ as your personal Savior, then the Salvation He provides is of no effect on you.

Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.

Elsie, since you know a huge amount about the religion of StormPrepper/1010rd, perhaps you could tells us when in the Mormon calculus Joseph Smith adds his assent to that of Jesus, so the Mormon righteous can enter heaven?

Matt 5: 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect

That's Jesus commanding all men to be perfect.

None of your verses actually claim what you are stating, and your readings are generally on the most shallowest of levels. Case in point, Matt 5:48 is in reference to the subject at hand: loving your neighbor, and cannot be in reference to perfection of mind, body and soul, as the scripture explicitly says that that is impossible for men, and there is no one good but God:

Psa_143:2 And enter not into judgment with thy servant: for in thy sight shall no man living be justified.

Luk_18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

Mar 10:26 And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? Mar 10:27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.

1Jn_1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Isa_64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

In other posts you write: You CAN'T get passed Jesus' own words.

In fact we don't need to, as none of your verses explicitly say that Christians will "enter into judgment" with the Father, and if that were true, it would explicitly contradict the scripture that says that we would stand condemned if that were to occur. Your reading also ignores all of the scriptures which declare that we are justified by faith, but that God works good works in us, and so the Elect are always demonstrating their salvation by their works, although they cannot be saved by them.

You go on: The Galatians were still following the law of Moses and Paul called them foolish for it.

This scripture does not distiniguish between different laws, but between all laws, as he immediately says afterwards that Abraham was justified by faith, and if by faith, then it is not by works, whether Jewish or otherwise. Romans 3 explicitly uses this terminology, "without works," and does not reference Jewish laws, but sins of murder, backbiting, and the like, which are all moral and universal. Wouldn't the book of Samuel the seer, the book of Nathan the prophet, and Gad the seer also be scripture? Ezra sure thought so.

This is a stupid defense of Mormonism since: we can prove that Joseph Smith is a liar from the many changes to the Book of Mormon; the original Egyptian papyri of the "Book of Abraham; his public claims of having only one wife when your church now attests he had about 20. And lastly, and most importantly, the direct contradiction of scripture your religion makes when it teaches that there are many gods, when the scripture knows only one: "Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any" (Isaiah 44:8).

Until you can get by such problems, you have no religion to pimp on this forum. It stands refuted and believed only by the deluded for whom no evidence matters.

Faith cannot help doing good works constantly. It doesn’t stop to ask if good works ought to be done, but before anyone asks, it already has done them and continues to do them without ceasing.

The passage in Matthew 25 when Jesus talks about the final judgment and He separates the "sheep" from the "goats". The sheep (the righteous) are astounded when Jesus tells them:

For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

“The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

Through their genuine faith, they did those things that accompany true faith without realizing they were doing them for Jesus.

The unrighteous, on the other hand, failed to do those things faith does and as Jesus spoke in Matthew 7:

Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Here they were doing all these mighty works for God, but they did them not in faith but by their own power and in order to boast of their own righteousness. Both passages tell us of the kind of faith that saves....just like Luther taught.

Elsie, since you know a huge amount about the religion of StormPrepper/1010rd, perhaps you could tells us when in the Mormon calculus Joseph Smith adds his assent to that of Jesus, so the Mormon righteous can enter heaven?

When?

I can't say.

It's another Mormon mystery one must take on faith I guess.

All I've done is to find some quotes; in Mormon archives; that tells us what we DO know some high ranking Mormon leaders apparently believed.

Here's where a Mormon comes in and says...

Well; if it's NOT in our Scriptures then we do not have to believe it.

Ezra sure thought so.

He did?

Can you show us how you've come to this conclusion?

Is the Song of Solomon the word of God?

Is the Book of Abraham the word of GOD?

You have to follow His commandments to the end of your life.

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned;

and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given,

and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned.

Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)

SoS is NOT scripture.

Oh?

God spoke to prophets all over the world, not just those in Palestine. All those prophets wrote down the words of God. God has the power to give us whatever words He needs us to have. And to give us the words He spoke to those other prophets. Just like Samuel the seer, and Nathan the prophet.

The elephants in the room are getting real antsy.

They want a bit of recognition; too.

Did God speak to Hinkley?

Buy more Florida land...

-- GOD

Does God speak to Monson?

Rebuild downtown SLC...

-- GOD

Did God speak to Mitt?

Do NOT run for president again; you LOSER!

-- GOD

How long before the name calling is to begin?

Good lawyering!

Always know the answer to any questions you might ask.

Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).

Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).

Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).

Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).

Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses , vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).

President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).

James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).

President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).

More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).

President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).

President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

I believe this question was posed by you and answered many times...So why do you keep asking???

Think of ELIZA...

http://www.manifestation.com/neurotoys/eliza.php3