Posted on 10/06/2015 10:35:57 AM PDT by envisio
Is baptism “works”?
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Detailed Answer......
Is water baptism a work?
Answer:
I have always been amazed at the dread shown by people toward the word “work.” You would think that it was a dreaded disease or something equivalent to sin.
The word “work” by itself is neither good nor bad. It simply refers to something that takes effort.
Faith is a work. “Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?” Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent”” (John 6:27-28). Faith is not necessarily automatic or naturally ingrained. Faith is something that we are commanded to have. “But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him” (Hebrews 11:6). This is why James tells us, “Faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works” (James 2:17-18). And Paul speaks of the obedience of faith (Romans 1:5; 16:26). Faith and works are not two disjoint topics, but two subjects that are closely intermeshed.
God’s intention is that man accomplish the work God has set out for him. “For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them” (Ephesians 2:10). In fact, it was Solomon who noted that it was for this reason man was placed on the earth. “Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God and keep His commandments, for this is man’s all. For God will bring every work into judgment, including every secret thing, whether good or evil” (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14).
Like faith, baptism is also called a work of God. “In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead” (Colossians 2:11-12).
When Paul told us, “work out your salvation with fear and trembling” (Philippians 2:12) he was not referring to works of man’s choosing, but those works laid out for man by God Almighty. There are those who claim to reject all works, claiming that they will be saved by faith alone. Yet, how much faith do they have in God when they will not obey His commands? Perhaps you believe that if a man truly believes, of course he will do the will of God. So, I must ask, if a person claims faith, but does not do the will of God, will he be saved? James tells us, “You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only” (James 2:24).
And if God says something saves but man claims it is unnecessary, does that man truly believe God? God said through Peter, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins” (Acts 2:38). Was Peter right that man must repent and be baptize to be forgiven or was he wrong? Or when Peter said, “baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ” (I Peter 3:21), was he right or wrong? Those who claim that salvation comes without works appear to lack the very faith that is necessary to save them from their sins.
Martin Luther coined the phrase, “salvation by faith only,” yet even he understood the role of baptism. In his Small Catechism in answer to the question “What gifts or benefits does Baptism bestow?”, Luther responded, “It effects the forgiveness of sins.” Concerning the sinner, Luther wrote, “Through Baptism he is bathed in the blood of Christ and is cleansed from sins.” He also wrote, “To put it most simply, the power, effect, benefit, fruit, and purpose of Baptism is to save.” In response to those who would call this a salvation by works, Martin Luther wrote, “Yes, it is true that our works are of no use for salvation. Baptism, however, is not our work but God’s.”
Now Martin Luther is just a man, but if the man who touted “faith only” understood that baptism was not a work that earns salvation, then it causes me to wonder why so many others do not understand.
http://lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVanswers/2004/2004-01-05.htm
Read post 41. And if you still deny baptism is a requirement unto salvation, you are a LIAR.
Baptism is not necessary for salvation. It is the initiatory sign and seal into the covenant of grace. As circumcision referred to the cutting away of sin and to a change of heart (Deut. 10:16, 30:6, Jer. 4:4, 9:25, 26, Ezk.44:7, 9), baptism refers to the washing away of sin (Acts 2:38, 1 Pet. 3:21, Tit. 3:5) and to spiritual renewal (Rom. 6:4, Col. 2:11-12). The circumcision of the heart is signified by the circumcision of the flesh, that is, baptism (Col. 2:11-12).
Peter downplays baptism for salvation... why? Cause Baptism is not required.
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you’re STILL LYING.
Acts 2:38 was preached by who? That’s right. Peter.
How about God’s Chosen? where is Baptism as a requirement in the Old Testament, none... it wasn’t a law given by God.
My salvation comes from Christ, it's not found in the OT. And it's impossible to find salvific baptism in the OT, before the sacrifice of Jesus' death and resurrection.
the reason baptism is not necessary for salvation is that we are justified by faith (Rom. 5:1, Eph. 2:8)
You're taking Eph 2:8 out of context. read in context it's clear that Paul was writing about Jewish Christians trying to impose circumsion on the Gentiles.
That’s an outstanding response! Well done.
Yes, there are some verses that seem to indicate baptism as a requirement for salvation. However, since the Bible so clearly tells us that salvation is received by faith alone (John 3:16; Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5), there must be a different interpretation of those verses. Scripture does not contradict Scripture. In Bible times, a person who converted from one religion to another was often baptized to identify conversion. Baptism was the means of making a decision public. Those who refused to be baptized were saying they did not truly believe. So, in the minds of the apostles and early disciples, the idea of an un-baptized believer was unheard of. When a person claimed to believe in Christ, yet was ashamed to proclaim his faith in public, it indicated that he did not have true faith.
See post 75. I agree with the point of amazement for LIARS who deny the need for baptism.
“What must we do to be saved?” is a pretty straight forward question. “Repent and be baptized” is a pretty straight forward answer.
Is that all that is necessary? No. No more than your stock answer of Romans 10:9 is all that is necessary.
I am not taking scripture out of context just because it goes against your belief - Hey, just saying if your grandma just accepted Jesus on her death bed, would she be saved with out baptism, according to scripture, yes... so you can be rest assured that she will meet you in Heaven.
ok, so you think you need to be dunked in water to be saved -
baptism is the symbol, an outward expression of repentance ... not for salvation
it can be that simple - Jesus didn’t come to save just the rocket scientists...
When you get to Heaven, you go ahead and tell Peter he too was LYING when he said repent and be baptized.
(Acts 2:38)
((Sheesh!))
Romans 10:9King James Version (KJV)
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. -
pretty straight forward to me...
and yes, I was baptized - October 18, 1990
It is written, not a requirement -
Romans 10:9King James Version (KJV)
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
If Romans 10:9 is all that is necessary to be saved,
Romans 10:9 New International Version (NIV)
9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
then I can discount and deny the need to REPENT?
As you see, this verse says nothing about baptism, just as it says nothing about hearing the word of God, just as it says nothing about repenting.
So. I can live just as evil a life as before - not turning away from my sin?
That’s what YOU and other Baptists are saying as you argue for your one dimensional “Billy Graham” plan of salvation.
You can repent from sin.. with out baptism...
Am I saying don’t do it? No, I am saying it isn’t necessary for salvation which is quite clear in the New testament, that it is Faith not by works... Can a man get baptized and not me “saved”... yes, it isn’t the outward baptism.. it’s the inward baptism, the cleaning by the “Blood” from Jesus.
Can someone do “good works” and not be saved? no, according to Scripture, you need to accept Jesus as Savior.. Baptism is a religious ceremony for the outward appearance of a spritual change. We say we immerse in the water to represent death, are we actually dying? no... so it’s just a show, which isn’t what Paul preached or Peter...
If Religious Ceremony is your thing, do it - not required to make God happy
“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God” (Eph. 2:8)
I made a lot of points and asked several question in post 95. But you ignored/chose not to answer one extremely valid question that negates your arguments and proves you wrong.
So I’ll re ask...
I can live just as evil a life as before - not turning away from my sin?
does baptism stop you from doing that?
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