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To: BlueDragon

“You’re living in a highly provincial (and severely limited) fantasy world if you believe that truth is entirely on your side of this discussion, and none of my own.”

No, you’re living in a fantasy world of your own making if you think truth can be fractured to satisfy your personal needs.


87 posted on 12/10/2015 5:10:30 PM PST by vladimir998 (Apparently I'm still living in your head rent free. At least now it isn't empty.)
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To: vladimir998

Truth itself, objective truth, the truth(s) of God are unchangeable as He is immutable & Eternal, and is not malleable to RCC "needs" either, nor is objective truth subject to the customs of men in regards to their own notions of Him, and again are not then, because those customs belong to one particular sect (the most sectarian of them all, judging by how RCC adherents often conduct themselves) become His own truth and self.

It's too bad that hasn't stopped those of that (Roman Catholic) church from inventing many a 'doctrine', including an inter-locking plethora which assert that it is *they*, and they either alone, or else foremost (only 'foremost' when they are in generous mood and acknowledge other Churches, such as *some* of the Orthodox) and are large and in charge of all things, not limited to merely ecclesiastical concerns, but as in past times have asserted themselves over governments and kings -- whenever they could sufficiently browbeat everyone into submission, that is.

When that didn't work, they'd hedge & make deals which included financial considerations --- collecting taxes FOR kings (and directly for the RCC too) taking a cut of the proceeds.

Taxation wasn't the only way they had tentacles interwoven into society, which in end results would (and often did) result in no one much being able to enrich themselves, unless either born into nobility and in the front of the line regarding familial inheritance (lands, estates, and all which went those) or else entrance into the priesthood to work one's way up through hierarchy to gain control of lands and peasant workforce (serfs). More than a few churchman held numerous Church titles at once, enriching themselves as absentee landlords, themselves living not as poor parish priests, but like the landed gentry class to which many of that class of "priests" were otherwise born.

One may try to argue for the more positive sides of these kind of arrangements, but the part where one prelate would hold sway over multiple estates (and be served by them, enriched by the $$$ those lands could produce) in absentee fashion was the Church hierarchy's doing, and was eventually a factor among others which resulted in people rising up against them.

Yourself or others may believe that Dark Ages Europe was the way the Lord most desired things to be, but the OT solidly enough refutes that notion, it being not the Lord who sought for Israel to be ruled over by earthly kings ("just like the rest of the world", as the Jewish people demanded).

But my own personal needs, you say? BWAAAHAAHA!

My own personal needs are not the issue, and saying so is also to attribute motive/get personal/make it all personal -- which you of course can rarely if ever cease from doing -- and when those "if ever" do come along, they never last, being always quite short in duration.

"Truth" fractured? No, I'm fracturing nothing much that is arguably objective truth.

How about ---mistaken assumptions be separated from truth.

That can done regardless of what is being sifted, and regardless of who does it- truth existing fully independent of any one person, or particular ecclesiastical association also.

That's more the way it was in the early Church. It was only much later that one particular gathering among all gatherings, or clusters of ekklesia, from among all whom were the Church up until that point, began to to vaunt itself as being "infallible".

There's some truth you could chew on for a while... while you try to get over the incessant butthurt (the RCC being thoroughly spanked) by corrections coming mostly from outside of it's own (then, during Reformation era defined) visible confines. If not for that pressure, there would have been no Counter-Reformation. Historians agree to that, except perhaps for the white-washers kind of historian.

89 posted on 12/10/2015 6:53:45 PM PST by BlueDragon
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