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To: Zuriel
How do you reconcile your wanting God to literally be flesh, when Jesus Christ and his aposltes declare God to be a Spirit and invisible? (John 1:18, 5:37, Col.1:15, 1Tim. 1:17, Heb. 11:27, 1John 4:12)

It's not a matter of "wanting" one thing or another. It's simply that "the word became flesh" signifies that reality of the Divine taking on human form; God in the flesh.

And it is true that no man has seen the Father in His heavenly Glory. But is also true that "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father." (John 14:9). The Scriptures are replete with paradoxes on these points. The correct answer accepts that, rather than simply favoring one set of verses over the others.

After his teaching on the ‘bread of life’, Jesus Christ declared that it wasn’t literally the flesh that gives life, but the Spirit:

“It is the Spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.” John 6:63

But back up 12 verses:

"51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.” John 6:51

"My flesh . . which I will give for the life of the world?" Who else can redeem the world but God? And how can that "flesh" give life to the world if it is merely an earthly. carnal thing? It has to be Divine as well or else the efficacy of the Redemption is called into question.

(What does "flesh" refer to in verse 63? Hint: it's not Jesus's flesh; to read it that way leads to contradiction, a flesh that "gives life to the world" that also "profits nothing.")

104 posted on 05/24/2016 2:12:30 PM PDT by CpnHook
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To: CpnHook

(sorry, I’m a OTR driver with no smart phone or laptop. Sometimes replies from me take days. My wife can view comments and let me know what has been said, helping me to reply quicker when I actually get home.)

**It’s not a matter of “wanting” one thing or another. It’s simply that “the word became flesh” signifies that reality of the Divine taking on human form; God in the flesh.**

Well, at least you are admitting to defining the Word as “God in the flesh”. Because God is not ‘God the flesh’. God was IN Christ reconciling the world unto himself.

**And it is true that no man has seen the Father in His heavenly Glory. But is also true that “Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father.” (John 14:9). The Scriptures are replete with paradoxes on these points. The correct answer accepts that, rather than simply favoring one set of verses over the others.**

There is no paradox to the teaching from Jesus Christ about the Father dwelling in him, doing the works (Jn 14:10). And I am not favoring one set of verses over others. I can go anywhere you choose to go, and point out these undeniable facts:

God the Father is omnipresent, omnipotent, and omniscient.
He literally dwells in Christ, and Christ in him.

(If God the Father is not literally IN Christ, then the Father is not omnipresent.)

Your body does not define your soul. Your soul defines your body. It’s what you say and do that defines you.

Jesus Christ came to redeem fallen man, but he also came to express the will of God the Father to mankind, man to man, which he did almost constantly.

**But back up 12 verses: “51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.” John 6:51**

Back up even more:

“..but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.” Jn 6:32

If you believe that the ‘bread from heaven’ is literally flesh, know that God the Father gave the Son his body (”..but a body thou hast prepared me.” Heb. 10:5)

**(What does “flesh” refer to in verse 63? Hint: it’s not Jesus’s flesh; to read it that way leads to contradiction, a flesh that “gives life to the world” that also “profits nothing.”)**

It is the Spirit of God that kept the flesh of the Son of God sinless, and therefore able to present the perfect will of God, to man, by a man.

If you believe that the ‘bread from heaven’ is words that proceed from that flesh, well, that comes from God the Father also:

Here’s a list of words and references, showing who was the original provider of knowledge (and all other things divine as well):
gave: 3:16, 10:29, 12:49, 14:31
gavest: 17:4,6,8,12,22, 18:9
give: 14:6, 15:16, 16:23
given: 3:35, 5:26,27,36, 6:39,65, 7:39, 13:3, 17:2(2),7,8,9,11,24(2)
received: 10:18
send: 14:26, 15:26, 17:8, Acts 3:20
sent: 3:17,34, 4:34, 5:23,24,30,36,37,38, 6:29,38,39,40,44,57, 7:16,18,28,29,33, 8:16,18,26,29,42, 9:4, 10:36, 11:42, 12:44,45,49, 13:16,20, 14:24, 15:21, 16:5, 17:3,18,21,23,25, 20:21
will (noun): 4:34, 5:30(2), 6:38,39,40, 7:17
will (verb): 5:20, 11:22, 12:26, 14:26, 15:26, 16:23
word and words (actually there are others that should be included, but the Son made it clear in the following ones whose ‘words’ they were): 3:34, 14:24, 17:6,8,14,17
work and works: 4:34, 5:20,36(2), 9:4, 10:25,37,38, 14:10, 17:4

doctrine: 7:16,17: “My doctrine is NOT mine, but HIS that SENT me. If any man will do HIS will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of GOD, or whether I speak of myself.”


105 posted on 05/27/2016 11:04:14 AM PDT by Zuriel (Acts 2:38,39....Do you believe it?)
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