Posted on 03/30/2002 7:53:37 PM PST by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
“Oh that you would keep silent, and it would be your wisdom! (Job 13:5)
Hello Havoc, I didn’t think you were speaking to me anymore.
Hit? Sounds like somebody got the holy water and the incense mixed up. They're supposed to throw the water, Dave.
I'm outta here.
BigMack
Could also be written this way for certain posters on this thread:
The even possibility that the Bible does make Mary a mother of more children is dismissed dogmatically.
I don't think so. I understand that one could read the Bible and come to the conclusion that Mary had other children. I accept that. I don't state that such a position does damage to the Bible.
I recognize that the Bible is ambiguous. It does not clearly make the case either way. Most of the NC's I have debted here do not believe so. They think it discounts the possiblity of perpetual virginity PERIOD.
SD
Who cares. Based on fact and 100% fact are not the same things. Scripture says one thing and you say another - mixing apples and oranges to do so:
Christ rules, and the saints live. God is not a God of the dead, but of the living.
God is the God of the SPIRITUALLY LIVING. But the Spiritually living STILL DIE in the flesh. Flesh, Spiritual. Flesh, Spiritual. Two different things - Or are you going to tell me that all the Christians who's bodies have decayed and fallen to dust for 2000 years really aren't dead but waiting on the latest betty crocker fudge cake to be a success before getting up to play Boggle one more time...
Ecclesiastes 9! Ecclesiastes 9:1 For all this I considered in my heart even to declare all this, that the righteous, and the wise, and their works, [are] in the hand of God: no man knoweth either love or hatred [by] all [that is] before them. [2] All [things come] alike to all: [there is] one event to the righteous, and to the wicked; to the good and to the clean, and to the unclean; to him that sacrificeth, and to him that sacrificeth not: as [is] the good, so [is] the sinner; [and] he that sweareth, as [he] that feareth an oath.
[3] This [is] an evil among all [things] that are done under the sun, that [there is] one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness [is] in their heart while they live, and after that [they go] to the dead.
[4] For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
[5] For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
[6] Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any [thing] that is done under the sun.
The new testament doesn't change one thing with regard to these verses above. Verse 2 cuts off all routes of escape for you before you even get to the heart of it. The Dead have no effect here - their time is passed.
I'm outta here.
A man of few words to the end. Sigh....
Do we get to keep Becky?
LOL. OK. What I meant was that you are from a faith tradition which accepts and is proud of the fact that it arose from the Reformation. Most of the other NC folks here are total freelancers and deny that the Reformation had anything to do with their faith.
SD
WOOHOO!!!!
Uh ... I mean ... gosh, we're gonna miss you, Mack. ;o)
Outa here for good, or just for today?
I thought the flesh was to no avail? So why do you make such a big deal about it?
Yes, Havoc, the two millennia of "dead" Christians are alive and well and with the Father in glory. I can't fathom why a Christian, especially just hours from celebrating the defeat of death, continues to make death an event, a barrier, a big deal.
Hey Havoc! Jesus won! Death lost.
SD
Whether by prayer or by course, the pain was gone within 48 hours. The blistering dissappeared over the weekend. Having been through 2nd degree burns before, I'd attribute it to prayer rather than the normal course of things.
Really?
When they had crossed, Eli'jah said to Eli'sha, "Ask what I shall do for you, before I am taken from you." And Eli'sha said, "I pray you, let me inherit a double share of your spirit"...
If Elijah was not going up to "H"eaven, but was rather merely taking the 5:30 fiery chariot flight to Cincinnati, why does Elisha speak of 'inheritance'?
As far as the letter to Jehoram...well, Elijah was a prophet, correct? Is it beyond the realm of possibility that he wrote the letter before the events of 2 Kings 2? And that someone else later delivered it for him?
Furthermore consider the case of Enoch:
Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him. (Genesis 5:24)
This is what the Christian scriptures have to say about Enoch:
By faith Enoch was taken up so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had taken him. Now before he was taken he was attested as having pleased God. (Hebrews 11:5)
Steven, I seem to remember you posting something on this a looooooong time ago, but I can't remember your take on it.
Great news!
I told you I was saying a rosary for you that second day, right? You think that did the trick? ;)
Try reading, Dave.
Yes, Havoc, the two millennia of "dead" Christians are alive and well and with the Father in glory.
Like I said, try reading. Jesus conquered spiritual death for us. All of us will still die in the flesh. All of us. The which is so obvious and normal that it's absurd you guys would actually even pretend to say otherwise.
I can't fathom why a Christian, especially just hours from celebrating the defeat of death, continues to make death an event, a barrier, a big deal.
The Lord rebuke you!
Hey Havoc! Jesus won! Death lost.
Yep, Jesus did win. And you and everyone of us here will still die. And Ecclesiastes 9 says the dead have no more effect in anything that ever happens here. PERIOD. 9:2 addresses the twisting of things that you're attempting, btw. It says this one event is common to the righteous and evil alike. The evil don't get eternal life - which rules out spiritual death as a way out of it for you.
Everyone have a blessed day and remember that Easter, like Christmas, is a season not just one day.
SD
Before you read too much into this, consider the date...
Matthew 12:46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.
So why would Jesus' mothers and brethren tell him that his mother and brethren were waiting?
My take is that God took him up to heaven.
Not the 'heaven' of the birds of the air? Not the 'heaven' of the stars of the sky?
Good, we are in agreement on something. ;o)
No my point is that we both make judgements (you call it reading hearts). Christ told us to make righteous judgement.
Well if that’s the case, I suggest you drop the Invincibly from your screen name and then you’ll have it.
You're a bitter man. (oops, I'm ready hearts again)
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.