MAN OF THE SHROUD

Various ^ | August 2002

[NYer]

The Shroud of Turin is a centuries old linen cloth that bears the image of a crucified man. A man that millions believe to be Jesus of Nazareth. Is it really the cloth that wrapped his crucified body, or is it simply a medieval forgery, a hoax perpetrated by some clever artist? Modern, twentieth century science has completed hundreds of thousands of hours of detailed study and intense research on the Shroud. It is, in fact, the single most studied artifact in human history, and we know more about it today than we ever have before. And yet, the controversy still rages.

Arguments against the Shroud's authenticity are prima facia, supported by carbon 14 dating and a prevailing view of the way things are in the world. On the other hand, the case for authenticity is a compelling preponderance of scientific and historic evidence. So daunting is the evidence that we can only wonder if, as  postmodernists suggest, "no such thing as objective truth exists, that historic reality is an inherently enigmatic and endlessly negotiable bundle of free-floating perceptions."1 The alternative is to consider, as C. S. Lewis contends: rare exceptions to nature are possible. 

On this hot and sultry day in August, I decided to post this thread for those who enjoy mystery, adventure and the thrill of discovery. There are many web sites devoted to this topic. I suggest you begin here:

SHROUD OF TURIN

[BlackVeil]

There are several deep lakes in Europe with legends of dragons or monstrous creatures living in them. And there were such legends back when people knew so little of natural sciences that they simply judged the evidence of their eyes, and gained no kudos from making such claims. So, who knows?

[Aquinasfan]

UCAI

That is very, very cool. The evidence is overwhelming.

[NYer]

read "The Ressurection of the Shroud"

My copy of the book arrived last week. This has to be the most exhaustive and conclusive research ever done on The Shroud. I am not even half way through Chapter 1. It is difficult to read as each detail delves deep into the harsh and brutally painful reality of the suffering inflicted on The Man of The Shroud. From the wounds on his head (counted and numbered) to the angle and placement of the nails in his hands and feet, forensic experts have learned much about the Roman methods of torture. I can't imagine the horror experienced by his mother and disciples, to witness this amount of suffering.

No expense was spared in the research. To cite just one example:

None of the unique scourge mark features are visible on the Shroud with the naked eye. The indented centers and raised edges are perceptible only when these areas of the body image are photographed and enlarged, then examined under a microscope. Ultraviolet light and fluorescence testing are needed to show the serum-fluorescing borders and to observe that scratches and cuts invisible to the unaided eye accompany the scourge marks. These findings are highly significant because they prove that the Shroud could not have been created by an artist in the Middle Ages. A medieval artist would not have had access to photographic equipment, a microscope, or an ultraviolet light source because none of the tools would be invented for several more centuries. There are more than one hundred scourge marks on the man in the Shroud. The inaccurate representation of just one of them would reveal an unnatural physiological reaction and expose the work as an artistic creation.

They found bruises, cuts, abrasions and dirt around the knees, consistent with someone who had fallen under the weight of a heavy beam. I strongly recommend this book and thank HumanaeVitae for having brought it to my attention.

Do you suppose there is a reason why all of this evidence should be made evident at this moment in time?

[JMJ333]

Among the facts related in the gospels, which are confirmed by modern science by the shroud are: bruises on the face, caused by the servants of the high priest; the scourging, which was by two men, one taller than the other, and which covered the entire body; the crown of thorns, which was a cap, not a circlet; the lance wound in the heat and the emission of a watery fluid as well as blood; the nail wounds, which were in the wrists, not in the palms so that the thumbs a, and which severed the median nerves, causing the thumbs to be jammed against the palms, so that the they are invisible on the shroud; the carrying of the cross, which rubbed against the shoulders and produced a large abrasion; the falls, attested to by the wounds on the knees and traces of dirt; the crucifixion itself attested by differing patterns of bloodflow caused by the crucified man's raising and lowering of his body in order to breathe. The shroud image also shows that two coins were placed over the eyes, as was customary in Jewish burials. The coins were ones minted by pontius pilate between October 28 AD and October 31 AD. The image also can be reproduced in 3D, and I have never heard of a painting or photograph that can do that.

The shroud even provides indirect confirmation of the resurrection. If the body had decayed in the normal way or even remained in the shroud for more than a few days the shroud would have been discolored and eventually itself decayed. If the body had been stolen or removed, large portions of the shroud would have adhered to the body, as any cloth would adhere to open wounds destroying the image.

Scientist try and discredit the shroud by using Carbon-14 tests, but those are often unreliable. They say it proves the shroud is from the 14th century, and say it proves conclusively that the shroud is a fake. They don't take into account that the shroud had been touched by many people and articles over the centuries...or that there was a fire in the Chambrey house in 1534 where the shroud was being kept. The heat was intense enough to melt the silver tub holding the shroud, yet the shroud didn't catch fire. Therefore, the tube must have been airtight. Both of the previous could have altered the test results.

All in All, I believe it is throughly authentic. =)

[american colleen]

I just put it in my Amazon.com basket, thanks for the heads up.

[NYer]

All in All, I believe it is throughly authentic. =)

I see you already have a copy; Colleen is ordering it from amazon.com.

Short of the Holy Grail, this has to be the most blessed relic. Since the Holy Grail has never been found (there are stories about a cup somewhere in Scotland), that would mean the Shroud IS truly the most blessed relic today.

Colleen, you will not be disappointed.

What is our suffering compared to His?

[HumanaeVitae]

Yeah, it is quite a detailed book. The technical chapters are a little rough...but this is without a doubt the final word on where current Shroud research is at.

I'm surprised more Catholics haven't heard of this book. I went out and got it after seeing the author, Mark Antonacci, on EWTN Book Notes. The book itself came out in 2000.

As far as why this information is coming to light, I think number one is that we now have the technology to do it; and number two a new century is arriving. I think the 21st Century will be the oppoisite of the 20th; hopeful and faithful without the massive wars, etc.

Anyway, I was also intrigued by Antonacci because he is a former atheist, like myself.

[NYer]

I was also intrigued by Antonacci because he is a former atheist, like myself

The introduction to the book was quite a story!! Yes, this would explain the level of scrutiny and indepth analaysis he applies to his investigation. Does he say that as a result of his research, he did find God?

This should be on the top 10 reading list for all catholics and christians. Thank you, again.

[HumanaeVitae]

"Does he say that as a result of his research, he did find God?"

I remember in his EWTN interview he states that he first got involved with the Shroud after the STURP project in 1978. After a thourough investigaton of their conclusions he himself concluded that the Shroud was real and converted.

And hey, you're welcome...great book. The history of the Shroud and it's continued miraculous "survivals" of fires, floods, wars etc. is worth the price of the book alone.

[JMJ333]

I don't have a copy of the book, but I assume it is a good book! I learned about the shroud from a History Teacher at Seton School in Manases, Virginia. =)

[NYer]

I don't have a copy of the book

Get it!! That's all I can say. Reading just the first chapter, I am drawn into the final hours of Christ's life. The brutal beatings, the "cap" of thorns, bearing a 100lb weight on his shoulders (arms tied to the crossbeam) so that particles of dirt were found on his forehead, nose and knees from when he had fallen, the nails that pierced his wrists forcing his thumbs inward, His body pushing upward to exhale air while hanging vertically on the cross .... I could go on. What misery or agony in our personal lives can even remotely come close to what He endured on His journey to calvary? The trauma to His body was so intense that He actually went into rigor mortis while still hanging on the cross. This is an absolutely amazing book that details an absolutely agonizing death ... for us.

[JesseShurun]

As much as it might be nice to think it's true, I can reject it on biblical evidence. The Lord's head was wrapped separately from the rest of his body. See the NT.

[JMJ333]

And I reject your post based on you being uninformed. See post 45. Thanks

[JesseShurun]

John 20, verse 7. Believe whatever you want to, I will believe the Word.

[JMJ333]

Please post your bible verse. And then please explain away my post 45. Don't come on the thread, make an accusation and then fling out some lame pronunciation on what you think is correct. Prove it.

[JesseShurun]

I have posted my bible verse, and there is no need to explain anything. The Word is the Word. It speaks for itself.

[JMJ333]

Post the verse on the thread. I am not going to do it for you, as it is you who brought it up. Lets see what it says. And then refute post 45 which you haven't looked at.

[JMJ333]

I will make it easy for you. Here is post 45. Please give your explanations.

"Among the facts related in the gospels, which are confirmed by modern science by the shroud are: bruises on the face, caused by the servants of the high priest; the scourging, which was by two men, one taller than the other, and which covered the entire body; the crown of thorns, which was a cap, not a circlet; the lance wound in the heat and the emission of a watery fluid as well as blood; the nail wounds, which were in the wrists, not in the palms so that the thumbs a, and which severed the median nerves, causing the thumbs to be jammed against the palms, so that the they are invisible on the shroud; the carrying of the cross, which rubbed against the shoulders and produced a large abrasion; the falls, attested to by the wounds on the knees and traces of dirt; the crucifixion itself attested by differing patterns of bloodflow caused by the crucified man's raising and lowering of his body in order to breathe. The shroud image also shows that two coins were placed over the eyes, as was customary in Jewish burials. The coins were ones minted by pontius pilate between October 28 AD and October 31 AD. The image also can be reproduced in 3D, and I have never heard of a painting or photograph that can do that.

The shroud even provides indirect confirmation of the resurrection. If the body had decayed in the normal way or even remained in the shroud for more than a few days the shroud would have been discolored and eventually itself decayed. If the body had been stolen or removed, large portions of the shroud would have adhered to the body, as any cloth would adhere to open wounds destroying the image.

Scientist try and discredit the shroud by using Carbon-14 tests, but those are often unreliable. They say it proves the shroud is from the 14th century, and say it proves conclusively that the shroud is a fake. They don't take into account that the shroud had been touched by many people and articles over the centuries...or that there was a fire in the Chambrey house in 1534 where the shroud was being kept. The heat was intense enough to melt the silver tub holding the shroud, yet the shroud didn't catch fire. Therefore, the tube must have been airtight. Both of the previous could have altered the test results.

[JesseShurun]

If you had said "Please" I would do so. I am not responsible to bad manners.