HOME/ABOUT  Prayer  SCOTUS  ProLife  BangList  Aliens  StatesRights  ConventionOfStates  WOT  HomosexualAgenda  GlobalWarming  Corruption  Taxes  Congress  Fraud  MediaBias  GovtAbuse  Tyranny  Obama  ObamaCare  Elections  Polls  Debates  Trump  Cruz  Kasich  OPSEC  Benghazi  InfoSec  BigBrother  IRS  Scandals  TalkRadio  TeaParty  FreeperBookClub  HTMLSandbox  FReeperEd  FReepathon  CopyrightList  Copyright/DMCA Notice 

Please keep those donations coming in, folks. Our 2nd quarter FReepathon is off to a great start and we have a chance of getting 'er done early! Thank you all very much!!

Or by mail to: Free Republic, LLC - PO Box 9771 - Fresno, CA 93794
Free Republic 2nd Quarter Fundraising Target: $88,000 Receipts & Pledges to-date: $36,590
41%  
Woo hoo!! And the first 41% is in!! Thank you all very much!! God bless.

Posts by smvoice

Brevity: Headers | « Text »
  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 3:28:20 PM PDT · 668 of 935
    smvoice to daniel1212
    Be sure to read the e-mail I posted to you. I wouldn't embarrass you in public here, but your attitude, actions and doctrinal knowledge of the Body of Christ is disgraceful. And I DO mean DIS-GRACE-FUL.
  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 3:24:29 PM PDT · 667 of 935
    smvoice to Kandy Atz
    THANK YOU. PRAYERFULLY OTHERS WHO SEEM BENT ON DISGRACEFUL DISPLAYS OF IGNORANCE WHEN IT COMES TO PAUL'S MESSAGE will either read and compare the scriptures for themselves, or hide their faces in shame and embarrassment.

    "STUDY to shew thyself APPROVED unto God, a workman that NEEDETH NOT TO BE ASHAMED, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH." 2 Tim. 2:15. It's in His word for a reason.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 2:48:59 PM PDT · 661 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter
    WHAT are you talking about? You are so lost in this you cannot see the foundation of the church and the church the body of Christ? I'm at a complete loss here. THAT BODY YOU DESCRIBED IS THE RESULT OF THE FOUNDATION BEING LAID BY PAUL.

    [[[shaking head]]]]. I cannot help you. I can only pray that God wills that you see Paul's unique ministry; a mystery HID IN GOD until it was REVEALED TO PAUL.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 1:54:12 PM PDT · 655 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; MHGinTN; CynicalBear; Kandy Atz; metmom; Mark17; winodog; Iscool; All
    There is a gospel of the millennial kingdom. And there is a gospel of the church the body of Christ. I'm going to attempt to show this to you, as plainly as I know how.

    Paul says he laid a foundation, he DID NOT say he built upon the foundation laid by Christ to Peter and the 11. That would be the foundation of the kingdom church. Paul's foundation is also built upon Christ. The plans and specifications for the building of THIS church were committed to Paul by the glorified Lord HIMSELF. "According to the grace of God which is given to me, as a wise masterbuilder, I HAVE LAID THE FOUNDATION, and another buildeth thereon." 1 Cor. 3:10.

    Indeed, in Eph. 2:20 he also says that we are "built upon the foundation of (laid down by) the apostles and prophets. That is, we are "built upon Jesus". One foundation was laid by Christ to Peter and the 11, The other foundation was laid by Paul UPON the foundation of Christ, also. But if they are the same, why did Christ give Paul plans and specifications for his church?

    We are built upon Jesus Christ; both the millennial kingdom church which was being constructed until Israel rejected Christ as their Messiah and God blinded them (temporarily) and set them aside; And also the church the body of Christ. We know Christ and our church is built on the foundation of HIM, but WE know Him differently now that Peter and the 11, Israel, and all who believed He was their Messiah.

    Whereas Peter and the 11 knew Him as the KING TO REIGN ON THE EARTH, we know Him (THE SAME PERSON) as the GLORIFIED HEAD OF THE BODY.(Eph. 1:19-23.

    Paul, by the Holy Spirit, indicates that a dispensational change has taken place, from being known as the KING to being known as the HEAD OF THE BODY. This is evident here:

    "WHEREFORE HENCEFORTH know we no man after the flesh; yea, THOU WE HAVE KNOWN CHRIST AFTER THE FLESH, YET NOW HENCEFORTH KNOW WE HIM NO MORE." 2 Cor. 5:16.

    Before that time men were expected to trust Jesus as "the Christ, the Son of the Living God," the King to reign as God on David's throne. BUT with the raising up of Paul Israel's rejection of Christ was assumed and WE trust the rejected KING as OUR GLORIFIED LORD AND SAVIOR. Hence, Paul declares:

    "If thou shalt confess with thy mouth JESUS AS LORD, and shalt believe in thy heart that God RAISED Him from the dead, thou shalt be saved." Rom. 10:9.

    The millennial kingdom church, which our Lord spoke to Peter must NOT be confused with the church described in Ephesians. The millennial church was a PROPHESIED CHURCH. The church the body of Christ was a MYSTERY. The plans and specifications for the kingdom church are found in the Old Testament. The plans and specifications for OUR church were "kept secret since the world began"(ROm.16:25), "hid from ages and from generations" (Col.1:26), "in other ages...not made known" (Eph. 3:5), but NOW revealed to and through the Apostle Paul. I know I've already given you this information, but thought I would make it easier for you, if you didn't have to go back and forth between posts.

    Peter and Paul, then BOTH built upon the same foundation, but whereas the millennial kingdom church will be BUILT UPON OUR LORD AS ISRAEL'S MESSIAH, the church of this PRESENT dispensation is BUILT UPON CHRIST AS THE GLORIFIED HEAD OF THE BODY, REJECTED ON EARTH, BUT EXALTED FAR ABOVE ALL, AT GOD'S RIGHT HAND IN HEAVEN.

    This distinction is CLEARLY brought out by a comparison of ACTS 2 WITH 2 Tim. 2. This is new stuff from me to you, so pay close attention here:

    In the FORMER passage Peter declares that God has raised Christ from the dead TO SIT ON THE THRONE OF DAVID (Acts 2:29-36). In the latter passage Paul exhorts Timothy:

    CONSIDER WHAT I SAY; AND THE LORD GIVEN THEE UNDERSTANDING IN ALL THINGS. Remember that Jesus Christ OF THE SEED OF DAVID WAS RAISED FROM THE DEAD ACCORDING TO MY GOSPEL. WHEREIN I SUFFER TROUBLE, AS AN EVIL DOER, even unto bonds; but the WORD OF GOD IS NOT BOUND." 2 Tim. 2:7-9.

    What does this mean? First of all take notice that Paul said if Timothy would consider what Paul was saying, the Lord would give him understanding in all thing. Evidently Paul and the Lord thought this was very important to consider.

    To understand what the apostle means when he says that Jesus Christ, OF THE SEED OF DAVID, was raised from the dead ACCORDING TO HIS GOSPEL, we need to find out where Paul speaks specifically about Christ being raised from the dead, where Christ is seated and what that has to do with David. Ephesians 1 and 2 finds Paul praying that believers might be given the spiritual PERCEPTION TO SEE

    "...what is the hope of His calling, and what the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints,

    AND WHAT IS THE EXCEEDING GREATNESS OF HIS POWER TO US-WARD WHO BELIEVE, ACCORDING TO THE WORKING OF HIS MIGHTY POWER,

    "WHICH HE WROUGHT IN CHRIST, WHEN HE RAISED HIM FROM THE DEAD, AND SET HIM AT HIS OWN RIGHT HAND NI THE HEAVENLY PLACES" (ePH. 1:18-20.

    "BUT GOD, WHO IS RICH IN MERCY, FOR HIS GREAT LOVE WHEREWITH HE LOVED US

    "EVEN WHEN WE WERE DEAD IN SINS, HATH QUICKENED US TOGETHER WITH CHRIST, (BY GRACE ARE YE SAVED)

    "AND HATH RAISED US UP TOGETHER, AND MADE US IT TOGETHER IN HEAVENLY PLACES IN CHRIST JESUS". (Eph. 2:4-6).

    So Christ was raised to sit on a throne at the right hand of God. David's throne, the millennial gospel attests to. And that is true. BUT it is ALSO where WE are sitting. We have been raised up together with Him, and made to sit together in heavenly places IN CHRIST.

    Did Peter or the 11 EVER PREACH that believers are now SEATED WITH CHRIST? No they preached that throne as far a it pertained to David. Paul preached that throne as it pertains to the church the body of Christ. Can you not see the difference here?< p>SURELY Peter would have preached such a message as Paul at PENTECOST, HAD he known it. But he DID NOT know it. At Pentecost he proclaimed Christ ONLY AS THE SAVIOR-KING WHOM GOD HAD RAISED TO SIT ON DAVID'S THRONE. He called upon Israel to REPENT AND BE BAPTIZED FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS SO THAT THE TIMES OF REFRESING MIGHT COME AND GOD MIGHT SEND BACK JESUS, WHOM THEY HAD REJECTED AND CRUCIFIED. Acts 3:19-21. Read Peter's Pentecost sermon AGAIN. And see what was ACTUALLY PREACHED by him, NOT what ANTICIPATED REVELATION would tell you he said.

    Prayerfully this gets through to those God wills.

    "Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things" Paul wrote. Consider his words, given by the Holy Spirit. From Christ to Paul to us, the church which is His body. Paul would not have "suffered trouble" over this had it clearly been understood by everyone.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 12:52:12 PM PDT · 650 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter

    Frankly I have addressed your simple yes or no questions. You just don’t care for my answers. I’m not going to play cat and mouse with you when you cannot even read plainly the words that are placed in front of you. If you want the answers to your questions, go back and read my posts. Don’t complain to ME that you haven’t been addressed. You haven’t been paying attention.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 12:48:58 PM PDT · 648 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter

    You just still don’t get it. Why would I say that the gospel of grace was first preached in Acts 3 by Peter, when Paul says that gospel was given to HIM to preach, by the risen Christ, and he is not saved until Acts 9. ??

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 12:47:34 PM PDT · 647 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter
    That's very interesting, because it is PAUL himself, BY THE HOLY SPIRIT, that says he received REVELATIONS AND VISIONS from the risen Christ.

    you should be ashamed. Comparing Paul's words to Mormons and Catholics. I'm certain the Holy Spirit wasn't leading you on THAT one.

  • Rome, Her Saints, & the Gospel

    05/28/2015 9:15:25 AM PDT · 10 of 178
    smvoice to RnMomof7
    "...was s mystic and stigmatic also known as "Mary Jesus Crucified." They just can't resist placing her in every point of Christ's life.

    Also known more recently as Marsha Brady. "MARSHA MARSHA MARSHA".

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/28/2015 7:17:38 AM PDT · 609 of 935
    smvoice to daniel1212; Kandy Atz
    You don't see the irony in your post to me, do you? Everything you are accusing me of is what you are doing to me. You just use more words and take up more space. So I'll make this as short and simple as possible. I think you've said here before that you are not a pre-tribulation rapture believer. This is important to this subject we are on, believe it or not.

    If you refuse to see that God has promised to keep us from His wrath, then you cannot see that this Church the Body of Christ has a definite beginning, mission, and end. It begins with Paul. It is built by visions and revelations Paul received from the risen Christ. And it ends when the last member of the Body is saved, making the body complete. I'm not even listing Scriptures for you here. You'll find them, WHERE, do you think? ROMANS THROUGH PHILEMON. That's right: PAUL'S WRITINGS.

    Just where do you think you are going to fit in the tribulation? God will seal 144,000 BELIEVING JEWS to preach the Messianic Gospel. God help anyone who stumbles across you at that time. They only have SEVEN years, NOT FIFTY. You can't say what you mean in only seven years.

    Good luck with all that. I would encourage you to read post 481. Kandy Atz wrote it. Perhaps you would like to write a book to this poster, telling him/her how wrong THEY are. Somehow I doubt that, however. Something tells me Kandy Atz would "contend for the faith once delivered". As you so ironically said. "The faith once delivered" refers to the message that PAUL was given. Which you cannot see, sadly.

    I will say no more. I will pray for you and wish you the best in all you do. Regards, smvoice

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 8:33:40 PM PDT · 583 of 1,017
    smvoice to boatbums

    Here’s a nice one to add: “...I will come to visionS and revelationS of the Lord”. 2 Cor. 12:1. Plural visions and revelations

  • Robert Gates to Boy Scouts: Surrender Your Principles

    05/27/2015 8:29:33 PM PDT · 26 of 32
    smvoice to cothrige

    Bwhahaha!! I’m sure Joseph Goebbels has a great grandson or two who could become “Youth Masters”

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 8:21:16 PM PDT · 579 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    I’ll take my chances ;)

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 8:13:03 PM PDT · 595 of 935
    smvoice to Iscool

    ...and meanwhile Paul had been receiving visionS and revelationS from the risen Christ. Plural.

  • BREAKING: Pope takes major step toward formal heresy

    05/27/2015 8:11:18 PM PDT · 312 of 1,178
    smvoice to terycarl; Iscool

    CRIPES! It’s Hotel Catholicfornia. “..Relax”... the nightman said soothingly...

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 8:05:01 PM PDT · 576 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    Maybe one day, God willing, we can get into that here. It would be fascinating and you’re just the type of person to lead the discussion (I just read the snippet on your website) :) So of course I want to know more. MORE I tell you!

    regards,

    smvoice

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 7:55:19 PM PDT · 574 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    Thanks so much for the info. I’m on my way to that link after I finish this post. And BTW: congratulations on being published! I can’t wait to read them. The first creation is the most INTERESTING part of Bible study, IMO. Thanks again! smvoice

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 7:52:46 PM PDT · 593 of 935
    smvoice to metmom

    I think it was absolutely necessary under the kingdom gospel. “Repent and be baptized for the remission of sins” sounds pretty clear. If a person desired salvation then, all he could do was what was demanded: repent and be baptized. Fortunately, thankfully, we are not under the law, but grace. :)

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 7:26:06 PM PDT · 572 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    Thank you. What do you think was on the first created earth? I’ve heard many ideas, and am interested in yours.

  • Practical help for the demon-possessed: Vatican rolls out new exorcism course

    05/27/2015 7:14:00 PM PDT · 16 of 42
    smvoice to MadMax, the Grinning Reaper

    That is what I’ve always believed. Poor thing could spook a stickhorse.

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 7:12:17 PM PDT · 570 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    I didn’t realize I WAS arguing as though I didn’t believe in a first creation age. I understand what you’re saying “for God so loved the world” meaning the first creation. I was thinking of the RE-creation that He was talking about. Before THAT re-created world was begun, He had already planned what this re-created world would be comprised of. Mankind. And He had a plan for mankind before He created them or the world they were going to occupy. I meant no harm.

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 6:49:52 PM PDT · 568 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    I do NOT dispute the first creation age at all. I absolutely believe it. God created it, it literally went to H*ll when Satan rebelled and was kicked out of His heavenly position. The earth reaped the complete destruction that Satan brought to it. God destroyed it and began again. But Before He began again, He had a plan for this man, Adam that He was going to create. “From the foundation of the world” and “Before the foundation of the world”. That was when the earth was RECREATED, not created.

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 6:44:20 PM PDT · 566 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism
    Because the early church was the Messianic Kingdom Church, made up of followers of The Messiah. Which included John the Baptist, Matt. Mark Luke John, the little flock, those who heard Peter's Pentecost sermon, believed, repented and were baptized. All built on the fact that Christ was God's Anointed Son, chosen to occupy the throne in the Millenial Kingdom. Jesus as rightful King and Son of God, was to be the very foundation of the Messianic church and this is how believers recognized the Lord at that time. It was Peter's confession of Jesus as "the Christ (Heb. Messiah, Anointed One), the Son of the living God that Christ began to build this church. And it was built until Israel as a nation was blinded (temporarily) and set aside because of unbelief and rejection of Christ as their Messiah. At that point the building of the Messianic church could not go on to completion. God is showing Israel that her house will not stand unless she recognizes Jesus as His Son and her King.

    Enter the church of this present age: the Church the Body of Christ. It was a secret which Peter and the eleven knew nothing about when they followed Christ as King and offered His kingdom to Israel at Pentecost.

    We, as members of the Church the Body of Christ now know Him in a different way. Whereas Peter and the eleven knew Him as the King to reign on earth, we know him as the glorified Head of the Body (Eph. 1:19-23). "Wherefore HENCEFORTH.." Paul states in 2 Cor. 5:16. Meaning from this point on. Meaning a change in what had previously been happening.

    Before Paul was saved, men were expected to trust in Jesus as "the Christ, the Son of the living God," the King to reign as God on David's throne. But with the raising up of Paul Israel's rejection of Christ was assumed and "Wherefore HENCEFORTH" we trust the rejected King as our glorified Lord and Savior.The Messianic Church was a prophesied church. The plans and specifications for THAT church are found in the Old Testament Scriptures.

    The plans and specifications for THIS church (the Church the Body of Christ) were "kept secret since the world began" (Rom. 16:25), "Hid from ages and from generations (Col. 1:26), "in other ages...not made known" (Eph. 3:5) but NOW revealed to and through the Apostle Paul.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 6:11:36 PM PDT · 585 of 935
    smvoice to wmfights

    Right. But they did not have faith in Christ per se, they had faith in what God told them would make them righteous before Him. They did not know the end result of their faith in what God instructed them until Christ went and preached victory in Abraham’s Bosom.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 6:07:16 PM PDT · 584 of 935
    smvoice to wmfights
    "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not or works, lest any man should boast." Eph. 2:8,9.

    "Moreover, brethren , I declare unto you THE GOSPEL which I PREACHED unto you, which also YE HAVE RECEIVED, and wherein ye stand; by which also YE ARE SAVED, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that CHRIST DIED FOR OUR SINS, according to the scriptures; and that HE WAS BURIED, and that HE ROSE AGAIN the third day according to the scriptures." 1 Cor. 15:1-4.

    How is someone saved today? These two passages of Scripture clearly tell us: 1) We are saved by grace (that is God doing whatever HE wants, even though we might not deserve it) through faith. 2). It IS a gift. 3)It is NOT of works (doing something and expecting something in return. 4). The gospel saves. 5). The gospel is: CHRIST DIED FOR OUR SINS, HE WAS BURIED< AND HE ROSE AGAIN.

    We have eternal life through Jesus Christ because, by His faith in God to raise Him from the dead, He was willing to die for our sins. If I believe in Him and what He has done for me (He died for my sins, was buried, and rose again) I stand JUSTIFIED before God (having no sin because Jesus took my sin, and I am justified because of the faith of Jesus Christ).

    If Jesus Christ is to be my Savior, I must acknowledge Him as such and believe that what He did was for me.

    There has not been a Scripture listed that has said, or implied that a person would have to "walk down an isle for Jesus", or "pray through until you receive the victory", or "say you were sorry for your sin". Scripture, and the gospel of the grace of God, in particular, only says that a person must acknowledge he is a sinner. We are saved, not by what WE do, but by what Christ DID for us. I do not see a single word of repentance in the gospel of the grace of God. In the kingdom gospel, yes. But read the gospel that Paul calls "my gospel", given to him from Christ to preach. 1 Cor. 15:1-4. Just the need to acknowledge that I am a sinner and Christ died for my sins. A person may weep when he realizes the work of Christ on his behalf, he may jump for joy, but neither of those count a bit for his salvation. It's not about how we react to the good news, it's about how we view the news.

  • Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

    05/27/2015 4:24:56 PM PDT · 561 of 1,017
    smvoice to DeprogramLiberalism

    Uh, I think God used “loved the world” because His plan for man was made from the foundation of the world, and in the case of this present age, “from before the foundation of the world.” Ephesians. Before He even created this earth, the plan was in place. That’s why He says “loved”.

  • From Southern Baptist to Goddess Worship, Sue Monk Kidd

    05/27/2015 1:59:14 PM PDT · 305 of 336
    smvoice to ought-six

    I know. My brother-in-law has MS, has had it for 20 years and is confined to a wheelchair. His right hand is the only limb that he can use. But I cannot begin to tell you of his tremendous strength, and hope, and contentment. All I know is it comes from God. He is truly an inspiration.

  • From Southern Baptist to Goddess Worship, Sue Monk Kidd

    05/27/2015 1:54:37 PM PDT · 303 of 336
    smvoice to ought-six

    OH, you’re RIGHT! It might have been Sandra Dee. When I think of goofy teenage movies, I always think of Sally Field. Her and Annette Funicellosomethingsomething...I watched them for Moondoggie. :) Yeah, I’m a “she” :)

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 1:50:57 PM PDT · 571 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear

    redleghunter, I cannot help you. That is obvious. You seem unable to even see how important the point is that Peter and the 11 were promised by Christ that they would sit on twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel when He returns and sets up His kingdom, while Paul was promised nothing of the sort, although YOU claim they all had the same message. It should strike you as odd that this is so. And should send you on a journey through God’s word, if for no other reason than to try to prove me wrong. But you’re ignoring the elephants I’m placing in the room and focusing on the dust bunnies in the corner. This is how I began to understand dispensationalism: by trying to prove someone wrong, I studied and I studied and I found out that I had been wrong, not that person. And I thank God daily for it. I will not be blown around by every wind of doctrine that comes along and I can show you Scripture by Scripture why that is so. I don’t have to make pretzels out of Scriptures in order to “try” to make them fit together and make sense. Example: “Repent and be baptized for the remission of sins.” Was baptism required for the remission sins?

  • From Southern Baptist to Goddess Worship, Sue Monk Kidd

    05/27/2015 1:41:34 PM PDT · 300 of 336
    smvoice to ought-six

    ...oh good...I thought you might be one of these younger generation type who knows no one before 2000. :)

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 1:35:36 PM PDT · 569 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear
    I really wish that posts, along with the Bible, were read as they say, NOT as the reader WANTS them to say. The gospel of the kingdom: what is given to do in order that a person is declared righteous before God?

    The gospel of the grace of God: what is given to do in order that a person is declared righteous before God?

    Did Abraham have to believe that Christ died for his sins, was buried and rose again the third day to be declared righteous before God? What about Moses? Or David? Or John the Baptist? Or Matt. Mark Luke John, the little flock of believers, or the hearers of Peter's Pentecost sermon? Were they told what was given by God to do in order to be declared righteous before Him? Where were they told this?

    And finally, what about us, now, in this age of the grace of God. Are we told what to do in order to be declared righteous before God? Where are we told this?

    Faith is ALWAYS counted for righteousness. Always has been, always will be. But faith in WHAT? Did God demand the same faith from David that He demanded from Abraham? IF he did, then David had a son that God required to be sacrificed. And on and on. Faith will do what God tells you He is requiring of you. And it's always counted for our righteousness, both BEFORE the Cross, although they did not know that their displays of faith all pointed to Christ, and AFTER the Cross. The believers of Israel ALL did was God demanded of them. In order to enter the Kingdom, not the body of Christ. I'm sorry you just cannot see, red.

  • From Southern Baptist to Goddess Worship, Sue Monk Kidd

    05/27/2015 1:17:09 PM PDT · 295 of 336
    smvoice to ought-six

    LOL! You’re joking, right??! The Flying Nun, Gidget, Norma Rae, Steel Magnolias, Smoky and the Bandit, etc. etc. Oh, and Sybil. “andthepeopleandthepeople....”

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 12:01:34 PM PDT · 562 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear
    That's right, I forgot. Acts 3 says that the people were pricked in their hearts and cried "what shall we do?" And Peter replied "Believe that Christ died for your sins, was buried and rose again the third day. There is nothing we can do to add to the finished work of Christ. For by grace are we saved through faith, and that not of ourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast."

    And right after he said that, the Jews all rejoiced, knowing that Jews and Gentiles were now one body, blessed with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ. And that the covenants God made with Abraham and David weren't really all that important after all.

    And they all lived happily ever after. The End.

    What is our great commission? Do you know it and where to find it?

    And BTW: what about those 12 thrones and Paul? Does he need to bring a stool to sit on in the Kingdom?

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 11:53:55 AM PDT · 560 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear; MHGinTN; winodog; metmom; Kandy Atz
    "According to THE GRACE OF GOD, which is GIVEN UNTO ME, as a wise masterbuilder, I HAVE LAID THE FOUNDATION, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. For other foundation can no man lay that that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." 1 Cor. 3:10,11.

    Hm. What does this mean? Paul is stating that he has laid the foundation, according to the grace of God which was given to him. Others are building on the foundation Paul has laid. But the foundation that is laid is built on Jesus Christ. If Paul was tasked by Christ to lay a foundation based on the grace of God that was given to him, why not thank Peter, if their gospels were the same gospel of the grace of GOd?

    Moses was the master-builder of the tabernacle. God gave him the plans and specifications for it, and said, "See...that thou make all things according to the pattern showed to thee in the mount" (Heb. 8:5). Moses represented the law.

    Paul represents grace. Paul too was a master-builder. To him God committed the plans and specifications for a greater building, "an holy temple", the church which is Christ's body. Step by step, revelation by revelation the details were made known to him by direct revelationS so that, as "a wise (intelligent) master-builder", he had the right and responsibility to outline those details to us, the body of Christ.

    "It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visionS and revelationS of the Lord." 2 Cor. 12:1. Visions and revelations, both plural.

    How can you expect us to give you a firm date when Paul says that his ministry and commission were based on REVELATIONS, not one, but more. It's a progressive revelation and building of the body of Christ, not a one moment in time event.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 11:04:26 AM PDT · 552 of 935
    smvoice to MHGinTN

    Amen. And the fact that we are still here speaks volumes to the patience of our Lord. Each day that He does NOT return to set up His kingdom, following the wrath of God being poured out on unbelievers, is another day to preach the matchless gospel of the grace of God. THIS gospel explains WHY He hasn’t returned yet. When the final member of the Body comes in, it’s over. We’re outta here and the tribulation and wrath begin, culminating in Christ’s return to set up His kingdom.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 10:51:33 AM PDT · 547 of 935
    smvoice to CynicalBear
    Yes it does. It seems to be of PARAMOUNT importance.

    "In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth." Gen.1:1

    God knows what His plan for man is/was/and will be. And we can rest assured that His truth will reign. It's HIS plan after all.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 9:42:39 AM PDT · 532 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; winodog

    If you can answer post 525 with Scripture, I will gladly enter into a discussion with you. Post 525 should be the “ah-hah” moment in what we’re discussing. Where ARE those twelve thrones that Christ promised Peter and the 11? And why was Paul not promised one, if they all preached the same message. This is important, redleghunter. It should serve to make you search God’s word for the answer, compare Scripture with Scripture and see things you may have never seen before. I apologize for offending you. It was not my purpose, my zeal just gets in the way of any longsuffering I may have, which isn’t much, as you can tell.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 9:05:57 AM PDT · 525 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear; metmom; MHGinTN; Mark17
    Let me just put this in this way: Matt. 19:28: "And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall SIT UPON TWELVE THRONES, JUDGING THE TWELVE TRIBES OF ISRAEL."

    Which part of the Body of Christ contains those twelve thrones that Peter and the 11 were PROMISED by Christ? And what about Paul? Where is HIS throne? If they all preached the same message, why doesn't Paul get a throne? And Paul states that in the body, there is neither Jew nor Gentile, we are one new man in Christ. How then are Peter and the 11 going to be judging 12 tribes of Israel when they body doesn't recognize a difference?

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 8:43:09 AM PDT · 519 of 935
    smvoice to winodog
    AMEN. Acts 8:1: "And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judea and Samaria, EXCEPT THE APOSTLES."

    They remained in Jerusalem. BTW: the church which was at Jerusalem was the kingdom church, established by Christ and given to the 12 apostles, the little flock, and all who believed, repented, and were baptized when Peter preached his great Pentecost sermon. It was a Messianic Church, by Jews, for Jews, awaiting the return of their Messiah to set up His kingdom, whereby they would become a nation of priest to the Gentile world. That is how the Gentiles would have learned about Christ.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 8:31:27 AM PDT · 513 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear

    Dear jimeny crickets, redleghunter, can you not read simple words? I have stated again and Again and AGAIN that the “gospel of the grace of God is Christ dying FOR OUR SINS, being buried, and then being raised again on the third day for our salvation. It is PETER who did not preach Christ dying FOR OUR SINS FOR SALVATION. Read his Pentecost sermon again. He preached Christ dying, being buried and rising again the third day as kingdom gospel. That when Israel as a nation realized that Christ was INDEED their prophesied Messish, they repented and were baptized so that the days of refreshing might come and God would send Christ back. Read Peter’s sermon AS IT IS WRITTEN, WORD FOR WORD. And don’t try to anticipate revelation that had yet to be revealed. You know it’s there because you’re HERE, looking back. But they did not have that luxury. They were told by Peter that Joel’s prophecy concerning Israel and Messiah’s eminent return to set up His kingdom was happening. And they believed it. So much that they repented, were baptized, gave all they had away and had all things in common, and awaited the eminent return of their Messiah, Jesus Christ. Read CB’s post 505. I cannot keep posting the same things again and again. Unless you decide to actually READ WHAT GOD’S WORD ACTUALLY SAYS>

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 8:18:53 AM PDT · 509 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; CynicalBear

    See Cynical Bear’s post 505. I am going to let the Holy Spirit handle this. After all, it is God that “hath revealed them unto us by His Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God” 1 Cor. 2:10. His job is to reveal truth.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 7:47:46 AM PDT · 504 of 935
    smvoice to redleghunter; daniel1212
    That's what the entire book of Acts is about. TRANSITION. From law to grace. From a kingdom of believers to a body of believers. From Peter to Paul.

    You can't say that it happened on June 14 at 3:00. But you CAN say that you KNOW, according to Paul's epistles, that it could NOT have begun before HE was saved and given the gospel of the grace of God to give to the Gentiles. I'm sorry you cannot understand this.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/27/2015 3:27:59 AM PDT · 486 of 935
    smvoice to Kandy Atz; metmom; MHGinTN; winodog

    Thank you, both Kandy Atz and winodog for your posts. I e-mailed you privately, but need to thank you on this thread. I am overcome right now with joy and relief. I was running out of ways to say it. And you showed up and just stated it beautifully. I pray God’s grace and peace on you and each member of the Body of Christ. Ours is a spiritual battle, and we must put on the whole armour of God in order to fight this fight. And when we are through, STAND.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/26/2015 8:10:28 PM PDT · 474 of 935
    smvoice to editor-surveyor

    I know you don’t editor. And I don’t know how else to explain it. The Words say what they say. It’s that simple.

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/26/2015 8:07:21 PM PDT · 472 of 935
    smvoice to metmom

    Will do. God bless!

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/26/2015 8:05:48 PM PDT · 471 of 935
    smvoice to daniel1212
    I feel I am forced to defend my position. And I will, with Scripture. One more time.

    I'll take it from the beginning: The first point states that both Peter and Paul preached the atoning death of Jesus Christ and His burial and resurrection. Peter did not preach the cross and Christ's death as GOOD NEWS. Read the sermon again. Peter at Pentecost had ACCUSED his hearers of crucifying Christ and had DEMANDED repentance and baptism for the remission of sins.(Acts 2:23,36,38). Paul proclaimed the crucifixion of Christ as GOOD NEWS (1 Cor. 1:18).

    Question: IF Peter preached the same gospel of the grace of God as Paul, why did Peter demand repentance and water baptism FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS? Peter referred to the crucifixion, BUT DID NOT OFFER IT FOR SALVATION. Read his sermon again to see this important point. Without preaching the cross as our salvation, there is no gospel of the grace of God. Christ was set forth to be a propitiation THROUGH FAITH IN HIS BLOOD (Rom. 3:25). THAT'S THE GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD.

    As an aside, did those who heard Peter's Pentecost sermon repent, get baptized and rejoice in the fact that they were now IN CHRIST? That their inheritance was in heaven and they were now all filled with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places? No. They repented, were baptized, sold everything they had, and waited for Christ to return to set up His kingdom. They did this because they knew prophecy and they knew the covenants God made with Abraham and David and they knew they were going to enter the millennial kingdom with Christ ruling. Is there anyone who can see this and see it's NOT part of the gospel of the grace of God, which pertains to heavenly blessings, but it IS part of the kingdom gospel which pertains to Israel, the Messiah, His kingdom, and their priesthood to the Gentiles.

    What Peter DID demand was demanded in the gospel of the kingdom though. So which gospel did he preach? One that DID include water baptism and repentance. NOT faith in the finished work of Christ, that He died FOR OUR SINS, or that faith in Him would place us, by the Holy Spirit, into the Body of Christ.

    1st Peter 3:18 is mentioned. THIS is about grace. But look when it was written, AFTER PAUL WAS SAVED, AFTER PAUL WENT TO JERUSALEM and communicated unto them (Peter, James and John) THAT GOSPEL that he preached among the Gentiles. They PERCEIVED THE GRACE THAT WAS GIVEN TO HIM and gave him the right hands of fellowship. Galatians Chapter 2. All of it. They learned the message (That gospel I preach among the Gentiles, Paul said) HERE. From Paul.

    Acts 26:19-20: "Works meet for repentance. Not works meet for salvation. Where is the "baptism for the REMISSION OF SINS"? that Peter preached? " Peter said "repent and be baptized FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS. He did NOT say "Should be baptized" or "if you feel led to be baptized". He said that remission of sins demanded 1)repentance and 2)baptism. This is what God's word PLAINLY states. Paul in no place states that repentance is demanded for remission of sins. Or baptism. Once again, one gospel DID demand these very things: the gospel of the kingdom. The gospel of the grace of God did NOT. THEY ARE DIFFERENT.

    Cornelius. Did Peter go to him as part of the great commission Christ gave them? Christ told them to go to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. So Peter must have jumped at the chance to go to a Gentile with the gospel. Acts Chapter 10 says differently. First he had to be given a VISION. He "rehearsed the matter". He "doubted in himself what this vision should mean. He had to be given the vision 3 times. For someone who understood that he was to take the gospel to all the nations, he sure did not act that way. If he already had been told what to do and he knew he was commissioned to do it, why the argument with God? In the gospel of the kingdom, the children (Israel) must be fed first. Once they have accepted Christ as Messiah, they are to go to the Gentiles with the good news. BUt they did NOT, as a nation, accept Christ. What could God do to insure that the Gentiles received salvation? He could wait to see if Israel would ever accept Him, He could postpone the times of the Gentiles until Israel had accepted Him, or He could raise up another Apostle, to carry the gospel of His grace to the Gentiles, apart from Israel. BTW: Note that Peter and Cornelius happens AFTER Paul is saved. This too is important. It is because of Peter's experience with Cornelius that Peter and the 11 ACCEPTED Paul's message and apostleship. Without the Cornelius meeting, Peter and the 11 would have remained preaching the kingdom gospel to the Jews and waiting for them to accept Christ before they went to all the nations. Does anyone understand this?

    And BTW what gospel would Peter have given Cornelius? That by grace he was saved through faith and that not of himself it was the gift of God not of works lest any man should boast? Or repentance and baptism for the remission of sins? Also, read Peter's sermon, Acts 10:34-48. He preached that Christ had died and was raised up the third day. But WHERE does he say that Christ's death was FOR OUR SINS? If Peter understood that whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins, that Christ's death was FOR OUR SINS, why baptize them? The baptism they preached was "repent and be baptized for the remission of sins". The very fact that he baptized them shows that baptism was part of that gospel. The gospel of the grace of God requires NOTHING to be added to the finished work of Christ for our salvation.

    And BTW: The Galatians baptism you wrote of is the Holy Spirit baptizing us into the Body of Christ when we are saved. It is spiritual, not water. It is the Holy Spirit doing the baptism, not water. Ephesians 4:4-6 makes that clear: there is NOW ONE baptism. Not two. Not water AND the spiritual baptism the Holy Spirit performs to place us into the Body. Both the baptism and circumcision are spiritual.

    The rest of your Scriptures are from 1 Peter. You do understand that by the time Peter wrote these he well understood Paul's message of grace?

    It truly is not my intention to argue with anyone. But it IS my intention to explain WHY, WITH SCRIPTURE that IF READ AS IT IS WRITTEN, I believe how I do. I cannot NOT stand for what I believe. And all our discussions are over the meat of God's word. We, as members of the Body of Christ, have all accepted the finished work of Christ for our salvation, and everything else is just Bible study, having no baring on our salvation. I hope you know and believe that. God Bless you with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ.

  • BREAKING: Pope takes major step toward formal heresy

    05/26/2015 5:33:10 PM PDT · 128 of 1,178
    smvoice to Mark17

    LOL! Me, too, brother. Me, too!

  • BREAKING: Pope takes major step toward formal heresy

    05/26/2015 4:53:27 PM PDT · 122 of 1,178
    smvoice to piusv

    THIS is what I respect so much about you, piusv. Your honesty. It’s a breath of fresh air. Regards, smvoice

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/26/2015 4:49:40 PM PDT · 466 of 935
    smvoice to editor-surveyor

    I pray God’s wonderful grace and His tender mercies for you. And His truth. Always His truth.

  • BREAKING: Pope takes major step toward formal heresy

    05/26/2015 3:37:17 PM PDT · 105 of 1,178
    smvoice to Jim Noble; RnMomof7; piusv
    It is. It's called "Baptism by Fire and Brimstone"

    I would listen, if I were you...:)

  • Why I am No Longer a Dispensationalist

    05/26/2015 3:33:28 PM PDT · 460 of 935
    smvoice to editor-surveyor; metmom; CynicalBear
    Can I just explain something to you. Hopefully, prayerfully, you will understand what I'm saying.

    It has ALWAYS been about GRACE. Anything God has ever or will ever do for us is through HIS GRACE toward us. You know that. But He has manifested His grace in different ways at different times. Adam, Abraham, Moses, David, Christ, Peter and the 11, Paul. And for different reasons, but the end result WILL BE: "That in the DISPENSATION OF THE FULNESS OF TIMES, he might gather together in ONE ALL THINGS IN CHRIST, both which are IN HEAVEN, and which ARE ON THE EARTH; even in him." Eph. 1:10.

    Who would benefit from God's grace on this earth? Israel, of course. The Abrahamic COvenant and the Davidic Covenant testify to this. GOd has promised them real land on this earth. For them, forever. And the Kingdom Gospel also testified to this.

    Who would benefit from God's grace in heaven? Those who were promised ALL spiritual blessings in HEAVENLY places. That would be those who are in Christ. Who are saved by grace through faith and not of themselves, by the GIFT of God, not of their works, lest any should boast. They are saved by believing that Christ died FOR THEIR SINS, was buried, and rose again the third day. THAT is the gospel of the grace of God.

    One gospel has to do with the earthly inheritance promised by God. The gospel of the kingdom. From God to Israel. And THEN to the nations, with Israel as a kingdom of priests, ministering to those nations.

    The other gospel has to do with a heavenly inheritance. The gospel of the grace of God. That is found from Romans through Philemon. THAT is where you will learn about that heavenly inheritance. And no place else. Because it was hid in God from before the foundation of the world, until he revealed it to Paul. Why would He have possibly revealed this to Peter and the 11? They were promised an earthly inheritance, where they will sit on twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel. That is the convenant God made with their fathers. And He doesn't lie. His grace fills all in all.