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To: woodpusher

Once again, they’re citizens but not Article 2 Section 1 natural born Citizens. You’re trying to conflate Citizen and Natural Born Citizen. They’re not the same.


77 posted on 01/03/2024 5:25:44 AM PST by Macho MAGA Man (The last two weren't balloons. One was a cylindrical objects Trump is being given the Alex Jones tr)
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To: Macho MAGA Man
Once again, they’re citizens but not Article 2 Section 1 natural born Citizens. You’re trying to conflate Citizen and Natural Born Citizen. They’re not the same.

A natural born citizen is one who acquires citizenship at birth. Citizen includes naturalized citizens and natural born citzens. There are two classes of citizen, and two only. Your straining to invent a third class is unavailing.

In re Look Tin Sing, Circuit Court, D. California, 21 Federal Reporter 905 (29 Sep 1884), Field J.

21 Fed. Rep. 906:

The first section of the fourteenth amendment to the constitution declares that “all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States, and of the state wherein they reside.” This language would seem to be sufficiently broad to cover the case of the petitioner. He is a person born in the United States. Any doubt on the subject, if there can be any, must arise out of the words “subject to the jurisdiction thereof.” They alone are subject to the jurisdiction of the United States who are within their dominions and under the protection of their laws, and with the consequent obligation to obey them when obedience can be rendered; and only those thus subject by their birth or naturalization are within the terms of the amendment. The jurisdiction over these latter must, at the time, be both actual and exclusive. The words mentioned except from citizenship children born in the United States of persons engaged in the diplomatic service of foreign governments, such as ministers and ambassadors, whose residence, by a fiction of public law, is regarded as part of their own country. This ex-territoriality of their residence secures to their children born here all the rights and privileges which would inure to them had they been born in the country of their parents.

21 Fed. Rep. 909

With this explanation of the meaning of the words in the fourteenth amendment, “subject to the jurisdiction thereof,” it is evident that they do not exclude the petitioner from being a citizen. He is not within any of the classes of persons excepted from citizenship, and the jurisdiction of the United States over him at the time of his birth was exclusive of that of any other country.

In Look Tin Sing, the U.S. Federal Court examined the case of a child of two Chinese citizens, born in the United States. Regarding the child, the Federal Court found that the jurisdiction of the United States over him at the time of his birth was exclusive of that of any other country.

The child with two foreign parents, neither of whom was even eligible for naturalization, when born in the U.S., is born under the jurisdiction of the U.S., exclusive of that of any other country.

The birther argument about jurisdiction has been losing in Federal court since 1886, ten years before Wong Kim Ark.

85 posted on 01/03/2024 12:56:22 PM PST by woodpusher
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