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To: SunkenCiv
The problem for these detectors is, the background level of neutrinos — the amount that would be expected from all distant sources — has been all that’s been picked up, whereas the neutrino stream from the Sun should be swamping the detectors, and it isn’t.

AHA!!!

~snip~snip~

From these experiments, and the Kamiokande and Super-Kamiokande neutrino detectors in Japan, the consensus has developed in the scientific community that the reason for the observed deficit of solar neutrinos is that the neutrinos “oscillate”. In other words, the electron-flavor neutrinos that are produced in beta-decay processes in nuclear reactions in the solar interior can be transformed into the other two known neutrino flavors, those of the muon-neutrino and the tau-neutrino. These neutrinos are not produced in the sun’s nuclear reactions. In this scenario, the measured solar neutrino flux is artificially low since these other neutrino flavors are not readily observed by most neutrino detectors, and certainly not at all by the radiochemical neutrino detectors. Note that for this process to occur requires that at least one of the neutrino types must have non-zero rest mass. Since the current Standard Electroweak Model carries the assumption of massless neutrinos, proof of the existence of neutrino mass would be a major new discovery, leading to major changes in the theory – what has been dubbed “New Physics”.
Whoa, I wonder if "New Physics" is anything like "New Math"? And what's your favorite neutrino flavor??? Me, I'm partial to chocolate but I didn't see it on the list. So, apparently these expensive toys are picking up solar neutrinos but not nearly what they expected, that is to say, the results were "unexpected". Imagine that. They coulda been Dim journalists. So, they're discovering something. And I suppose at some point there may actually be some useful results derived from all this target practice? Like maybe they'll discover white dwarfs or red giants or quasars(supernovae?) produce many times more proper neutrinos than yer garden variety yellowish star? They'd have something then -- wouldn't they???

I dunno Civ, it just seems to me that's some awfully expensive playtime that may ultimately produce nothing of any practical value. But you and I both know I could be wrong about that, eh?

16 posted on 10/18/2010 9:21:07 PM PDT by ForGod'sSake (You have just two choices: SUBMIT or RESIST with everything you've got!)
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To: ForGod'sSake
yup. Here's a 2004 topic from Patrick Henry (physicist I think, banned now): Here's a relevant reprise:
Ernest Lawrence, a pure experimentalist... said, "Don't you worry about it -- the theorists will find a way to make them all the same." -- Alvarez by Luis Alvarez (page 184)

I must reiterate my feeling that experimentalists always welcome the suggestions of the theorists. But the present situation is ridiculous... In my considered opinion the peer review system, in which proposals rather than proposers are reviewed, is the greatest disaster to be visited upon the scientific community in this century. No group of peers would have approved my building the 72-inch bubble chamber. Even Ernest Lawrence told me that he thought I was making a big mistake. He supported me because my track record was good. I believe U.S. science could recover from the stultifying effects of decades of misguided peer reviewing if we returned to the tried-and-true method of evaluating experimenters rather than experimental proposals. Many people will say that my ideas are elitist, and I certainly agree. The alternative is the egalitarianism that we now practice and that I've seen nearly kill basic science in the USSR and in the People's Republic of China. -- ibid (pp 200-201)

18 posted on 10/19/2010 11:13:36 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
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