In our continuing discussions on whether pocket pistols are good enough to carry for personal protection. We sometimes hear of the small few gun enthusiasts that carry these .22 pocket pistols. Posted on 02/13/2019 4:48:36 AM PST by w1n1
In our continuing discussions on whether pocket pistols are good enough to carry for personal protection. We sometimes hear of the small few gun enthusiasts that carry these .22 pocket pistols.
For personal defense the goal is to always "break contact" from the "Bad Guy" if you’re ever caught in such dire situation. Breaking contact is to get away from the BG either you had the six sense to avoid the confrontation or caught in the fight. Once you have fired on the BG, the goal is to stop the BG from his attack so you can run away.
Terminal Ballistics
From a terminal ballistics stand point the .22 is not that impressive from a short barrel pistol. But the .22 is more capable than people think. To make this point we looked at these tests that were conducted by the fine folks from Lucky Gunner. Lucky Gunner ran a 1.9 inch snub nose pocket pistols with several types of .22 Magnun loads against a ballistic gel.
This was for measuring the penetration and seeing the expansion. What we’re striving for is a good 12 to 15 inch penetration with less expansion. These depths are considered good from the FBI standards. So ideally, when combined with good shot placement to the vital areas of the torso, this should deter/stop the BG from attacking you.
.22 Magnum – More Umph
For the loyal .22 fans the answer for some more umph to your load is the .22 Magnum. Shooting it from a two inch barrel is quite loud, the recoil is a little more than a .22LR but still easily manageable. Failure to fire at times does still exist with the .22 Magnum. (light primer strike) Many gun nuts know to slighly remedy this by installing a heavier spring, but the trigger pull is now at between 12 to 15 pounds. Yeh, more so than the standard .38 Special. So if this doesn’t deter you from not investing in a .22 pocket pistol, lets move on to some decent loads that are specifically for personal defense. You’ll also see some velocity, penetration and expansion info results from the ballistic gel. Read the rest of 22 WMR ammo.
I figured NY would be ideal 1911 territory, because of that draconian safe act.
I use my piece to shoot snakes on the farm, most at 5-7 yards i did get one at 35 yards or so, after 6 near misses at it swimming away.
ASJ are the only people giving any weight to the Ellijah study. 1800 shootings is too few to support any widespread conclusions on handgun effectiveness because it can’t carry statistically significant numbers covering all the possible cartridges used for SD/HD/CCW across all geographic and socioeconomic groups. It’s like doing statistical analysis of the cars in a bowling alley parking lot on Saturday night and pretending it’s representative of the automobile buying habits of the country as a whole.
No, they have an irrational fear of all semiautos in the hands of non-elite people. My permit for a 7 shot .357 revolver breezed through, as I was told it would by the lawyer I had to hire to grease the skids.
“I guess that’s right, but as long as a single pop of 22WMR costs as much as a 9mm, I won’t buy a 22WMR platform. I go right from 22LR rifles and pistols to 9mm and 5.56mm. “
I have a Ruger Blackhawk I bought many years ago that came with two cylinders; one shoots shorts, Longs, long rifles. The other shoots the WMR. Over the twenty plus years I’ve had the gun I’m guessing I probably haven’t shot more than a couple boxes of WMR through it. My favorite plinker though is my Ruger stainless Mark II bull barrel. Also have a Rossi pump that shoots the short, long, long rifle that’s a fun plinker. When it comes to center fire my favorite is 1911 types, got a couple of those. My wife enjoys shooting the Beretta 92F 9mm. She carries a Ruger stainless Speed Six 38 spl 2 1/2” barrel. Reason being she doesn’t carry a semi is she doesn’t shoot enough to have developed necessary muscle memory for various scenarios that may occur.
“...the .22 Magnum’s real name is .22 WMR, which stands for Winchester Magnum Rifle...most .22 WMR loads...the powder is designed for a longer burn in a rifle length barrel...performance in a shorter barrel handgun is...less than optimal...” [Yo-Yo, post 35]
The R in WMR stands for rimfire, according to period literature from Winchester. A minor point of nomenclature; scarcely anybody today calls it anything except “22 Mag.” Everything else you posted is dead on.
Rimfire rounds pose problems in autoloaders, handguns, and especially in small concealable handguns for self defense.
I spent 13 years working part time for a small family-owned dealership, in gun repair. One of our most common modification requests was for trigger pull “improvement” (read: reduction) on rimfire handguns. Many women found rimfire double action pull weights impossibly heavy. We worked on the problems at length; our boss was female and was careful to attend to the concerns of women as customers (in contrast with numerous other dealerships in the area, many of which had trouble emerging from the prior era, when guns were more of a manly thing, territory the “little lady” did not venture into often).
We had to disappoint most customers: as other posters have pointed out, rimfire rounds always require a heavier blow to ignite reliably. The moment we lightened the pull, on just about any handgun, failures to fire cropped up. It was always worse with very small handguns, which had smaller, lighter hammers with a shorter throw, and thus required a much heavier mainspring. 12 to 15 pounds double action was lighter than average, when we measured pull weight on rimfire handguns.
22 WMR was designed for bolt action rifles. Autoloaders chambered for it - rifle or handgun - always experienced feed reliability problems, quite apart from ignition reliability. The rimmed case was simply too long and narrow, and so thin it often sustained damage while feeding. We never could induce a 22 Magnum autoloading pistol to function all the time; strings of 25 to 30 rounds would feed and eject OK, then the arm would misfeed. Kel-Tec’s PMR-30 seems promising, but I’ve not seen one yet, nor tested any. Field testing may tell.
All rimfire handguns are very sensitive when it comes to ammunition. Applies across brands and can sometimes appear from lot to lot of a nominally identical loading: rounds made several years ago may work, but rounds that just arrived from the factory will not. Someone determined to use a 22 rimfire for self-defense would be prudent to buy a number of different brands and loads, then test them extensively for accuracy and feed reliability, and ignition reliability. Accuracy and reliability seem to be independent variables: often, we found that the brand & load delivering best reliability exhibited poor accuracy, or the most accurate load was less reliable.
Compromises cannot be avoided.
Sub-Sonic ammo is The Trick!
“Crap Shot!”,,,
#memoo.
Yes, it has earned an incredible reputation. The only thing the .357 has on it is the ability to reach our much farther. If you’re in a city, that extra range is probably a negative not a positive.
The other thing 357 has is the ability with the right load to penetrated some body armor. Of course good bullet placement negates that advantage too.
The .22 might not be a scary round but no one wants to get hit by it. The day of the recipient just took a turn for the worse. Even if there is not a serious injury, it's going to hurt like hell.
My head hurts from reading this. Don’t they have an editor?
( : >)
“I’m a pilot and my shot placement has always sucked”
Are you firing from the cockpit? ( : >)
Only rockets and I always had a handy computer to help me.
Pretty large caliber babes, too.
I had (post active duty) one stint on the ground basically so I could qualify to keep a m16 and pistol at home as a civilian. (Israel)
I was scared to death I was going to flunk proficiencies test. Rifle I was fine. Pistol I scored 81/100 and you needed 80 to qualify.
Too big. Only need 7-8 rounds.
Check these out. Identical interchangeable 30-round mags, 22WMR out of a pistol or carbine. The pistol is the size and half the weight of a Glock 19. The carbine weighs like half an AR. As fast as you can pull the trigger, 30X 22WMR.
Kel-Tec PMR pistol, 90 rounds in 30 seconds. Zeri recoil. Virtually point of aim to 200 yards.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2KZMI-qNvY
Shooting the Kel-Tec CMR-30 Lightweight 22 Magnum Semi-Automatic Carbine - Gunblast.com
Skip ahead to 9:30, or watch it all.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry89JDxzItA
They take the same mag. 22WMR. Nasty. No recoil. Accurate. Flat shooting.
That PMR 30 has been on my radar for a long time. I have watched the reliability improve as exhibited by reviews. My best buddy just bought one and I am anticipating his feedback.
I am sure there are female gun instructors in your area that would enjoy helping you find a suitable firearm that fits you. These days you can rent a gun at a gun range to test what you like to shoot.
My two cents.
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