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MN: Another Mis-Trial in Self Defense Case of Alexander Weiss
Gun Watch ^ | 30 October, 2019 | Dean Weingarten

Posted on 10/30/2019 3:48:47 AM PDT by marktwain



On Sunday, on 14 January, 2018, a bit after 8 A.M., Alexander Weiss was on his way to officiate a basketball game in Rochester, Minnesota. The streets were slippery. Weiss saw another car spin out of control. He stopped to see if they needed assistance. 

It turned out he occupants of the care were teenagers who were using illegal drugs. The car had been deliberately put into a "spin" for kicks. The drive of the car which had spun out backed up and hit Weiss car. The two male 17-year-olds got out of their car and acted aggressively toward Weiss. Weiss had a bumper sticker on his car that said "GUN CONTROL IS HITTING YOUR TARGET”.  I wrote about it in 2018.

Weiss retrieved his phone and a 9mm pistol, for which he had a carry permit, and warned the aggressive teens he was armed. At some point, it appears one of the teens spit on Weiss. Weiss said Muhammed pushed him and tried to grab his pistol. Weiss shot Muhammed and immediately called the police. There is some limited surveillance video of the event. Muhammed was an immigrant from Iraq who came to the U.S. six years earlier. The case went to trial.

The bumper sticker was brought up in the trial.

The Jury was unable to reach a unanimous verdict, and a mistrail was declared.  That was in June of 2019. The prosecution decided to re-try Weiss. They did so.  On 22 October of 2019, another mistrial was declared, after the jury could not reach a unanimous decision. From myfox47.com:
ROCHESTER, Minn. (FOX 47) — On Tuesday, the jury for the Alexander Weiss case couldn’t reach a verdict, forcing Judge Joseph Chase to declare a second mistrial, turning this into a complicated process.

FOX 47 talked to Meshbesher and Spence Law Partner, Zach Bauer, a legal expert, independent from the case, to talk about what this means and what could be coming next.

He says in his experience, it would be rare and uncommon to see a case tried more than three times, but the future of the case is now in the hands of the prosecutor, whether they want to go through a third trial.

“There’s really no limits to the amount of times it can be retried,” said Zach Bauer.

Multiple trials are devastating to a defendant. They have to repeatedly pony up the expenses of a trial, over and over. The bumper sticker was brought up again at this trial.



Commenters about the case are split about the verdict as well, which explains the jury having a difficult time in reaching a unanimous verdict. It is unknown if the prosecution will seek a third trial. There has already been much punishment by process.

One thing that played prominently in discussions of the trial and situation was that Weiss returned to his car to retrieve his phone and 9mm. It appears his actions would have been considered more justifiable in Minnesota if he had not returned to retrieve his phone and 9mm.

It is a good reason to have your defensive firearms secured on your person.

Several commentators observed that if Minnesota were a "Stand Your Ground" state, the trial would likely never have taken place.

 Could Alexander Weiss have de-escalated? Should he have?  It is not clear.

One thing is almost certain, Alexander Weiss wishes he had never stopped to try to help someone in distress. In this case, they did not want or need his help, and had deliberately precipitated the events he witnessed.

In the first trial, the surviving male witness testified for the prosecution. His testimony did not go well for the prosecution. In the second trial, the same man was forced to testify for the defense.

We will see if the Rochester prosecutor decides to conduct a third trial.

©2019 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice and link are included.

Gun Watch


TOPICS: Government; Politics; Society
KEYWORDS: banglist; mn; selfdefense; weiss
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Minnesota is *not* a stand your ground state. The prosecution is saying Weiss should have fled the scene when he retrieved his pistol.
1 posted on 10/30/2019 3:48:47 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

Why does “the law” expect people to run away from or leave their own personal property behind, when faced with these types of situations? As a matter of fact Mr. Weiss had just as much right (if not MORE RIGHTS) to be there with his damaged car, as compared to those drugged-up people in the other car who damaged his car.

And retrieving a gun which may be necessary for self-defense (in this case it seems to have been proven a prudent choice), isn’t a sign of “aggression.” It isn’t a sign of “escalation.” It’s a sign of self-preservation, something we each have a RIGHT to!!


2 posted on 10/30/2019 4:15:50 AM PDT by ExTxMarine (Diversity is tolerance; diverse points of views will not be tolerated.)
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To: marktwain

Alexander Weiss is being punished for exercising his First and Second Amendment rights. The thugs in the prosecutor’s office want to discourage other responsible citizens from preparing to defend themselves against democrats who are just being democrats.


3 posted on 10/30/2019 4:42:32 AM PDT by Pollster1 ("Governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed")
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To: ExTxMarine
"Why does “the law” expect people to run away from or leave their own personal property behind, when faced with these types of situations?"

Lawyers elected to legislatures tend to make laws that benefit lawyers. This case points that out.

4 posted on 10/30/2019 5:02:45 AM PDT by fella ("As it was before Noah so shall it be again,")
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To: marktwain
Keep the gun bumper stickers off of you car..

they invite trouble.

Should it be that way in America? No, but it is.

5 posted on 10/30/2019 5:55:23 AM PDT by G Larry (There is no great virtue in bargaining with the Devil)
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To: marktwain
"Minnesota is *not* a stand your ground state. "

Rochester is about 80 miles south of Little Mogadishu which is on the west bank of the Mississippi River. Saint Paul, on the east bank, is probably pushing this prosecution.

6 posted on 10/30/2019 5:58:38 AM PDT by outofsalt (If history teaches us anything, it's that history rarely teaches anything.)
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To: marktwain

Based upon the facts described in this article, and nothing more, I agree that the decisions of the juries were absolutely correct. Namely, the evidence available simply does not support a guilty verdict ergo “the system” worked beautifully.

AND, for the first time in my long life, I’m going to cry “racism” too. In Minnesota, a white male is a target of liberals and particularly the UBER liberal prosecutor types found in Minnesota.


7 posted on 10/30/2019 6:17:53 AM PDT by Cen-Tejas
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To: marktwain

Again, that 2nd which our founding fathers granted us is being beaten down.

What’s Mo’s rap sheet? Bet this wasn’t his first time doing illegal drugs and driving recklessly. How many other times had he physically assaulted someone? I doubt the bumper sticker wasn’t in cursive so what was his problem reading that warning. That bumper sticker is the same as “beware of dog” signs. Mo got what he deserved. Weiss should have been given the key to the city for stopping that pig from doing further harm to society. And that would be American society and not MN’s islamic society.


8 posted on 10/30/2019 6:57:50 AM PDT by bgill
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To: marktwain

When he went to get his phone and gun he could have just driven away.

Having a bumper sticker like that is just stupid.

I’m all for the right to carry but it is for the purpose of defending yourself when there is no other way out, not to be a tough guy against some idiots.


9 posted on 10/30/2019 7:26:22 AM PDT by shelterguy
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To: shelterguy

“When he went to get his phone and gun he could have just driven away.” - That would be leaving a scene of an accident.

“Having a bumper sticker like that is just stupid.” - Ya, the first amendment sucks (sarc.)

“I’m all for the right to carry but it is for the purpose of defending yourself when there is no other way out, not to be a tough guy against some idiots.” - A guy coming to your aide is not a tough guy. When someone reaches for your pistol to take it out of you hand, you have to immediately assume they will use to kill you.

Go back to your safe space, I mean shelter, guy.


10 posted on 10/30/2019 8:12:07 AM PDT by Mr. Mohasky (Common sense in a world lacking any, will be perceived & construed as an extreme point of view.)
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To: G Larry

Keep the gun bumper stickers off of you car..


I have heard that “Beware of Dog” signs invite trouble for the same reason.


11 posted on 10/30/2019 8:17:36 AM PDT by hanamizu
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To: Mr. Mohasky

Whatever you say, tough guy.

If someone hurts your feelings, shoot them.

It’s idiots like this guy who give legitimate gun owners a bad name.

His life was not in danger, he could have simply left the scene when he walked over to his car to get his gun.


12 posted on 10/30/2019 8:20:22 AM PDT by shelterguy
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To: shelterguy

No one is advocating shooting someone for hurt feelings, that’s what liberals do.

Somebody aggressively tried taking his gun from him, and he defended himself. It’s the DA who is A-hole here.

And again, leaving the scene of an accident is a crime.


13 posted on 10/30/2019 9:15:01 AM PDT by Mr. Mohasky (Common sense in a world lacking any, will be perceived & construed as an extreme point of view.)
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To: Mr. Mohasky

And again, leaving the scene of an accident is a crime.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

No, it is not. If you feel you are in danger you can leave and call the police from a safe area.

This tough guy was able to walk back to his car to get his phone and gun. He could have easily left the scene and called the cops from somewhere else.

I work in public housing projects in Minneapolis and St Paul all the time. I have walked away from situations a number of times instead of escalating a no win situation.


14 posted on 10/30/2019 9:34:52 AM PDT by shelterguy
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To: Mr. Mohasky
Go back to your safe space, I mean shelter, guy.

In one of my CHL classes (which was taught by a former cop), he advised us not to get involved in these types of situations. He said that even if you are right, you may still be indicted and sued, etc. I don't think anything Weiss did should have led to his being prosecuted, but I know my instructor would have advised him to leave the area. He also advised us to not have gun-related bumper stickers. It tells people you are likely carrying and they can break into your vehicle looking for the guns you may have stashed inside.

15 posted on 10/30/2019 9:51:25 AM PDT by Sans-Culotte (With every passing day, I am a little bit gladder that Romney lost in 2012.)
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To: shelterguy

The “Tough Guy” in this case was the drug addict immigrant who acted aggressively after hitting someone else’s car, then spit on him, and then tried to take his gun.

What is wrong about a man defending one’s person and property?

The only thing I see the guy should have done differently is call the cops immediately while also arming himself, and keep 911 on the phone for a recording of the events.


16 posted on 10/30/2019 10:59:02 AM PDT by Mr. Mohasky (Common sense in a world lacking any, will be perceived & construed as an extreme point of view.)
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To: Sans-Culotte

My concealed class, taught by current sheriffs, advised us somewhat similarly, and also to avoid districts and counties that under control left-leaning politicians and prosecutors whenever possible. Any lawyers or politicians, either side of the aisle, hell bent on making a name for themselves will destroy you and bankrupt you.

What is not mentioned in this article, or perhaps I missed it, is at what point was the phone and gun retrieved? Did he get out to help the spinning car, and when it hit his car, go and get the phone/gun, then to be confronted by the driver and passenger of the other car? Or did he go get his phone and gun after he was confronted and spit on?


17 posted on 10/30/2019 11:07:27 AM PDT by Mr. Mohasky (Common sense in a world lacking any, will be perceived & construed as an extreme point of view.)
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To: Mr. Mohasky

Walk away. Call the cops. Avoid two trials.

Or be a tough guy suburban commando and ruin your life.


18 posted on 10/30/2019 11:12:45 AM PDT by shelterguy
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To: shelterguy

Is “Tough Guy” your word/phrase of the day? LOL. It’s been on every post on this subject.


19 posted on 10/30/2019 12:57:52 PM PDT by Mr. Mohasky (Common sense in a world lacking any, will be perceived & construed as an extreme point of view.)
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Comment #20 Removed by Moderator


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