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To: Elsie

You seem to think there is a problem when Heavenly Father has us fix mistakes.

It is you that has the problem.

Since your god does not correct you by reveluation any longer you can only follow learned men with a science of words called hermeneutics to understand what God says to you.


75 posted on 11/17/2019 12:19:37 PM PST by fproy2222
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To: fproy2222
You seem to think there is a problem when Heavenly Father has us fix mistakes.

Most folks would think a problem occurred when the 'mistake' was made that NEEDED being corrected later:


"Now the way he translated was he put the urim and thummim into his hat and Darkned his Eyes than he would take a sentance and it would apper in Brite Roman Letters. Then he would tell the writer and he would write it. Then that would go away the next sentance would Come and so on. But if it was not Spelt rite it would not go away till it was rite, so we see it was marvelous. Thus was the hol [whole] translated."
---Joseph Knight's journal.


"In writing for your father I frequently wrote day after day, often sitting at the table close by him, he sitting with his face buried in his hat, with the stone in it, and dictating hour after hour with nothing between us."
(History of the RLDS Church, 8 vols.
(Independence, Missouri: Herald House,1951),
"Last Testimony of Sister Emma [Smith Bidamon]," 3:356.

"I, as well as all of my father's family, Smith's wife, Oliver Cowdery and Martin Harris, were present during the translation. . . . He [Joseph Smith] did not use the plates in translation."
---(David Whitmer,
as published in the "Kansas City Journal," June 5, 1881,
and reprinted in the RLDS "Journal of History", vol. 8, (1910), pp. 299-300.

In an 1885 interview, Zenas H. Gurley, then the editor of the RLDS Saints Herald, asked Whitmer if Joseph had used his "Peep stone" to do the translation. Whitmer replied:

"... he used a stone called a "Seers stone," the "Interpreters" having been taken away from him because of transgression. The "Interpreters" were taken from Joseph after he allowed Martin Harris to carry away the 116 pages of Ms [manuscript] of the Book of Mormon as a punishment, but he was allowed to go on and translate by use of a "Seers stone" which he had, and which he placed in a hat into which he buried his face, stating to me and others that the original character appeared upon parchment and under it the translation in English."


"Martin Harris related an incident that occurred during the time that he wrote that portion of the translation of the Book of Mormon which he was favored to write direct from the mouth of the Prophet Joseph Smith. He said that the Prophet possessed a seer stone, by which he was enabled to translate as well as from the Urim and Thummim, and for convenience he then used the seer stone, Martin explained the translation as follows: By aid of the seer stone, sentences would appear and were read by the Prophet and written by Martin and when finished he would say 'Written,' and if correctly written that sentence would disappear and another appear in its place, but if not written correctly it remained until corrected, so that the translation was just as it was engraven on the plates, precisely in the language then used."
(Edward Stevenson, "One of the Three Witnesses,"
reprinted from Deseret News, 30 Nov. 1881
in Millennial Star, 44 (6 Feb. 1882): 86-87.)

In 1879, Michael Morse, Emma Smith's brother-in-law, stated:
 
 "When Joseph was translating the Book of Mormon [I] had occasion more than once to go into his immediate presence, and saw him engaged at his work of translation. The mode of procedure consisted in Joseph's placing the Seer Stone in the crown of a hat, then putting his face into the hat, so as to entirely cover his face, resting his elbows upon his knees, and then dictating word after word, while the scribes Emma, John Whitmer, O. Cowdery, or some other wrote it down."
(W.W. Blair interview with Michael Morse,
Saints Herald, vol. 26, no. 12
June 15, 1879,  pp. 190-91.)


Joseph Smith's brother William also testified to the "face in the hat" version:
 
"The manner in which this was done was by looking into the Urim and Thummim, which was placed in a hat to exclude the light, (the plates lying near by covered up), and reading off the translation, which appeared in the stone by the power of God"
("A New Witness for Christ in America,"
Francis W. Kirkham, 2:417.)


"The manner in which he pretended to read and interpret was the same manner as when he looked for the money-diggers, with the stone in his hat, while the book of plates were at the same time hid in the woods."
---Isaac Hale (Emma Smith's father's) affidavit, 1834.




77 posted on 11/17/2019 4:23:02 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: fproy2222
It is you that has the problem.

I see...


“I told the brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding by its precepts, than by any other book.” (History of the Church, 4:461.)

-- Joseph Smith

 
 

78 posted on 11/17/2019 4:24:11 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: fproy2222
It is you that has the problem.

HMMMmmm…


The MOST correct book??
 
 
Just some of the 3000+ changes...

Mosiah 21:28
Original 1830 - "...king Benjamin had a gift from God, whereby he could interpret such engravings;..."
1964 change- "...king Mosiah had a gift from God, whereby he could interpret such engravings;..."

3 Nephi 22:4
1830 -"...for thou shalt forget the shame of thy youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy widowhood any more."
1981- "...for thou shalt forget the shame of thy youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy widowhood any more."

I Nephi 12:18
1830 - ...yea, even the word of the justice of the Eternal God, and Jesus Christ, which is the Lamb of God... (historical note- Jesus Christ was not revealed to the Nephites until II Nephi 10:3.)
1981 - yea, even the word of the justice of the Eternal God, and Messiah which is the Lamb of God...

80 posted on 11/17/2019 4:25:17 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: fproy2222
Houston; we; uh; seem to have a; uh; problem; uh; again...


“I told the brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth,
and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding by its precepts,
than by any other book.” (History of the Church, 4:461.)

“The most correct of any book on earth” was a bold statement to make in Joseph Smith’s day,
let alone in our day of sophisticated publication.

The statement is still applicable, for the Lord has never rescinded it nor cast doubt upon it.

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1984/06/the-most-correct-book?lang=eng

 

 

 

 

81 posted on 11/17/2019 4:27:02 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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