Posted on 02/25/2023 12:06:12 PM PST by gitmo
Part of the problem was that the Passion narratives in the Gospels put the blame for Jesus being condemned to death on the Jewish leaders (although it was Pontius Pilate who gave the order--crucifixion was a Roman method of execution). Ignorant Christians in later times then believed that contemporary Jews had inherited the guilt for Jesus' death--even though in Christian belief Jesus' death was necessary for humanity to be saved and everyone was guilty because of original sin.
The Jesuits rule over us
Some groups are obsessive about their supposed stature in the world, and they push their children to achieve. You can say that this is a good thing, but there is a fine line (e.g. supportive involved parent vs helicopter parent). Also, there is a big difference between fact-based intelligence and creativity. Both are very important. I would personally argue that the more regimented your youth is the more risk there is that your creativity will be stifled.
It takes all kinds of different people to make the world and to push the achievements of humanity further. We should never cede 'superiority' to any group of people. We are all individuals, and individual pieces of the puzzle.
Are you suggesting that Jews haven’t stood out in creative fields?
The Bible recounts that even the Jews of the Exodus went against God's covenant and were condemned to die in the desert before the devout were delivered to the promised land.
Even the devout, Moses himself included, were fallible to the consequences of free will when exercised at the wrong time when they were expected to know better.
There was no zero bail for them. That was the example that was set for the chosen people, and that was also the example that was rejected by those who hate the Jews.
-PJ
Hatred is not generally a good look in general, but I’m not sure if you are making a larger statement on “the chosen” here as well.
I'm saying that since the Biblical text designated the Jews as the chosen people, it naturally inflamed the senses of everone else.
Just as with the Hatfield's an McCoy's, after a few generations people forget why they hate the other side, but they know that they must hate them and can never stop or be called a heretic.
Just look at our kids in the public school system today versus what their grandparents believed.
-PJ
I don’t think it’s that simple—either projecting from the Bible to the present or as (full) causal explanation of resentments today.
No. I was talking generally about how pushing children too hard at young ages can stifle creativity. My background is partially Jewish. People are people, irrespective of their background.
Their success is only part of it. They’re also exclusive, religious/orthodox Jews at least. To set yourself apart, to be resistant to integration into the greater society, is to invite suspicion.
Lump those two together — resentment and suspicion — and you get a roiling cauldron of xenophobia.
It’s human nature, and it’s self-inflicted, but I think the Jews see that as just another of the burdens they bear for being the chosen people.
I am saying that. I'm saying that there are deep cultural beliefs that have been inculcated over generations and millennia that have manifested into the identify of some peoples.
Where did Hitler get his hatred of the Jews?
Why do so many people hate black people?
I'm saying that people don't really know the roots of why they hate certain people, but they hate them nonetheless. Why did people enslave the black Africans 250 years ago, and does that have roots in why people still hate blacks today? Should we only look at why blacks are resented today without regard to the historical path that got us to today? Why put blinders on the hatred of the Jewish people in a similar way?
I'd go further to hypothesize that hatred for Jews is almost universal across the globe right now. Can the same be said for Africans? Can the same be said for any other cultural people?
Can it be said that the hatred of Jews is a global phenomenon that is not paralleled by another other race of people? Can it be surmised that something profound in the past of history is behind such a phenomenon?
I'm not a Biblical scholar by any means, but I've read that there are Great Flood stories in many cultural historic texts, not just in the Bible. I can't say if this has been archaeologically proven or just historic propaganda, but if similar epic stories have been repeated in diverse cultural histories, then why can't we assume that hatred for the Biblical chosen people was another epic story that perpetuated across the cultures of time and history?
-PJ
People are people, but I think there’s plenty of evidence that beyond basic nutrition nature is stronger than nurture in driving intelligence—and there’s not much point to denying that apparent truth.
...In many historical societies including ancient Christian, Jewish, and Islamic societies, usury meant the charging of interest of any kind, and was considered wrong, or was made illegal....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usury
No doubt there has been deep prejudice against Jews, particularly in Europe that goes back hundreds of years. But there’s also been at this point over a hundred years of disproportionate Marxist agitation from Jews and controversial Zionist/Israel geopolitics that I think are at least perceived as contributors to more recent resentments. I’d suggest there are many factors involved.
Similarly, but also very differently, there no doubt was a very early and persistent sense of inferiority conferred on Africans as they were “discovered” by European adventurers and exploiters, reinforced by at least perceived disproportionate crime rates added more recently to the mix.
But there also is great admiration and warmth directed toward these two populations that have been disproportionate contributors to entertainment and culture as well. Again, it is complicated.
Hatred of course is a bad human weakness all around. But it probably wouldn’t exist if it weren’t at times protective insofar as it at times helps populations to mount defenses in circumstances of war and invasion, for example. We can be a squirrelly species. Just look at the current global environment.
When you are dealing with traits determined by multiple genes that sort separately during reproduction, what you wind up with will be highly variable. That's why separate children from the same parents look different and often have very different personalities. Of course, as we've discussed, the 'nurture' aspect also plays a significant role.
There are no groups of people on the planet who are inherently smarter than others. That kind of thought process led to the myth of Aryan superiority that Hitler used as propaganda and that led to a world war and the deaths of millions - including millions of Jews in one of the most inhumane and hateful atrocities ever seen.
I think the expectation that all groups are absolutely equally intelligent, on average, is fiction on the level of the modern trans movement. The same goes for pretending that all families and individuals are absolutely equally intelligent.
I’d suggest those who can’t accept that have placed too much value on intellectual power—and with such misplaced emphasis have lost what is equal and precious in all.
Lordy these threads bring it out
How Jews are viewed is very complicated
Some scorn some bring on themselves
Some scorn is a result of envy or resentment
And a lot more stuff
How u behave in the host nation or culture has consequences
In their case sometimes extremely brutal and non proportional
As such, making statements that individuals from (name your favorite background or group) are more intelligent than others is just not accurate. Some undoubtedly are, some undoubtedly aren't.
None of what you describe is secret knowledge or relevant to the practical outcome of intelligence, which obviously is not, on average, perfectly equally distributed across groups or families or individuals.
That is a simple truth. I don’t get your contortions to avoid acknowledging such.
Responding to your three statements:
1) If you are suggesting proof of something or looking for acclamation that your greatgrandfather was a Polish Jew in the service of the Imperial Russian army, I can say that I hope your greatgrandfather was able to keep his Judaism in the Russian Army. The Czar kept Jewish boys in his away from their families for about 25 years and away from their ability to practice their religion. That was the Czarist goal and, alas, it seems to have worked in your family, as it did so very often. By the time these Jewish boys were releases from service, if they survived, they were old men by the longevity standards of the time. Since I infer that your greatgrandfather’s children did not count themselves Jews, that the Czar’s plan worked in your family.
2) I am aware of the infusions into the teachings of some parts of the Presbyterian church.
3) You live in Hawaii: Nice place. Some of my best friends are Hawaiians.
4) While I am sure your obscene imperative to me was heartfelt, I do not have the technical skill(s) that would be needed to accomplish your order.
5) Your last word was “Democrat.” Perhaps you are signing off as a Democrat. Perhaps, instead, you are asserting that I am a Democrat. If that’s the case, you have batted 1,000 in your error score. I speedily fled the Democrat Party more than 30 years ago. Note my screen name.
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