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Hands Off! That Fact Is Mine
Wired ^ | 3/3/04 | Kim Zetter

Posted on 03/03/2004 12:53:13 PM PST by LibWhacker

Edited on 06/29/2004 7:10:22 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

Imagine doing a Google search for a phone number, weather report or sports score. The results page would be filled with links to various sources of information. But what if someone typed in keywords and no results came back?

That's the scenario critics are painting of a new bill wending its way through Congress that would let certain companies own facts, and exact a fee to access them.


(Excerpt) Read more at wired.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: act; collections; copyright; database; facts; hr3261; ideas; information; misappropriation; monopoly; owning
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1 posted on 03/03/2004 12:53:15 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker
Patent and copyright, which started out as a decent concept 200 years ago, is now totally out of control. Soon, SCO and the RIAA will claim rights to every human thought.

Burn everything! (To your CD drive)
2 posted on 03/03/2004 1:00:46 PM PST by BlazingArizona
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To: LibWhacker
Talk about turning long-held aspect of copyright completely on its head just because a special interest group bribed contributed to a few congresscritters. Nevermind, already happened with copyright terms, so why not what can get copyrighted. But at least the change to infinite copyright was gradual.
3 posted on 03/03/2004 1:01:49 PM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: LibWhacker
The sole purpose of modern-day intellectual property law is to enable lawyers to own everything... even YOUR phone number.
4 posted on 03/03/2004 3:53:18 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (Drug prohibition laws help fund terrorism.)
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To: LibWhacker; bvw; per loin
The pioneer spirit yet lives!
5 posted on 03/03/2004 4:18:53 PM PST by secretagent
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To: LibWhacker
Welcome to the New Dark Age.
6 posted on 03/03/2004 4:26:34 PM PST by meadsjn
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To: LibWhacker
It is Euro-puke served up in fine cyrstal to the dim-wits in the House:
The U.S. House Judiciary Committee approved HR 3261 (the "Database and Collections of Information Misappropriation Act") on January 21. As this bill represents yet another discouraging expansion of American copyright law, it merits a look. For those who want to read the full text, it is available in PDF format.

Unlike many bad intellectual property ideas, database protection is an idea being imported into the U.S. from Europe. Efforts to prevent the "misappropriation" of databases have been ongoing for some time; the first version of the current proposal - based on the 1996 EU database directive -- was considered in 1996. It did not pass, but anybody who has watched the legislative system in operation has learned that these things keep coming back until the interests behind them finally get what they want. That would appear to be happening here.

(Source: "HR 3261 and the ownership of facts", http://lwn.net/Articles/68462/ )

Are there men who are sons of men still in the House, that will act to toss this bilge-water out?
7 posted on 03/03/2004 5:32:27 PM PST by bvw
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To: LibWhacker
Someone cannot secure thier databases from a friggin HTTP spider and they call a lawyer? Dopes.
8 posted on 03/03/2004 5:39:20 PM PST by Spruce
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To: LibWhacker
They cry to the L-rd in their adversity, From their distress He delivers them,
And causes them to tread in a right way, To make it a City of Life.
They proclaim to the L-rd His kindness, And His wonders to the sons of men.
For He hath satisfied a longing soul, And a hungry soul hath filled with goodness.
And that's stolen from DATABASE too! Come after me, for pilfering it ... if you dare, those of you who are with the dim-wit legislators!
9 posted on 03/03/2004 5:43:28 PM PST by bvw
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To: LibWhacker
Fine.

If my name, address, phone number, SSN, driver's license number, credit card number, bank account number, etc., are in their databases, then I want a royalty from every fee that they receive.

-PJ

10 posted on 03/03/2004 5:46:09 PM PST by Political Junkie Too (It's not safe yet to vote Democrat.)
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To: Political Junkie Too
And there it is, but how many Lexus driving lawyers can YOU afford?
11 posted on 03/03/2004 6:16:46 PM PST by bvw
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To: bvw
Unlike many bad intellectual property ideas, database protection is an idea being imported into the U.S. from Europe.

That's strange. Bad copyright laws usually start in the U.S. and spread outwards.

12 posted on 03/04/2004 6:42:27 AM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
The sole purpose of modern-day intellectual property law is to enable lawyers to own everything... even YOUR phone number.

The phone book matter has already been decided in favor of freedom (Feist Publications, Inc. v. Rural Telephone Service Company, Inc.). But I guess that's about to change.

13 posted on 03/04/2004 6:45:16 AM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat
I think the best understanding is that Europe, with it's common and historic concepts of "droit d'seigneur" -- the ownership of things by a a nobility -- is the breeding ground of excessive copyright expansions.

History shows this is the case. The US has (thankfully) been resistant to such overreaches against Freedom.

For example consider the following:

1886/7 - The seminal Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works is signed (in Berne, Switzerland). It intends to give international copyright protection to the creative works of the citizens of European member state signatories. Works protected include: novels, short stories, poems and plays; songs, operas, musicals, sonatas and symphonies; drawings, paintings, sculptures and architectural works. In the International Copyright Act of 1886, Great Britain gives assent to the obligations of the Berne Convention. This Act abolishes the requirement to register foreign works, and introduces an exclusive right to import or produce translations. The U.K. ratifies the Berne Convention with effect from 5th December, 1887. The U.S., however, remains governed by its 1790 Copyright Act, and is not subject to the Berne Convention. Longstanding U.S. literary and musical piracy of works by European authors and composers (and vice-versa) continues to be an accepted way of life for publishers, until finally brought to an end by the establishment of separate bilateral copyright agreements with the U.S.. The Berne Convention is revised in 1908 and 1928. The Berlin Act of 1908 extends the duration of copyright to the life of the author plus 50 years, takes account of new technologies, and declares that formal registration is unnecessary in order to hold a copyright. The Rome Act of 1928 is the first to codify the moral rights of authors and artists.
It is with sad irony I note what passes for "moral acts" in Rome just as the Third Reich was getting started.
14 posted on 03/04/2004 7:47:21 AM PST by bvw
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To: antiRepublicrat
Source for above quoted text:
Music Business Journal, "History of Copyright - A Chronology"
http://www.musicjournal.org/01copyright.html
15 posted on 03/04/2004 7:49:43 AM PST by bvw
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To: bvw
If you get 100,000 people in a class action, you can afford one or two.
16 posted on 03/04/2004 7:59:07 AM PST by philetus (Keep doing what you always do and you'll keep getting what you always get)
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To: LibWhacker
Funny. The Database owners complain about theft. That is a simple failure to secure your information, I guess their outsouced security engineer is cheaper vice better.

Additionally, where in the heck do these "owners" get the bulk of their information? From doing basically the same thing as the "thiefs" are doing to them. I guess they want finders keepers in place for public information.

Lawyers, you've got to hate them.
17 posted on 03/04/2004 8:08:11 AM PST by American_Centurion (Daisy-cutters trump a wiretap anytime - Nicole Gelinas)
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To: LibWhacker
This isn't new. A similar measure, with Bill Clinton's approval, was attempted in the summer of 1997. The head of the Library of Congress, I believe, was working with it. Genealogists went to bat and swamped their elected representatives' offices with calls. It was defeated.
18 posted on 03/04/2004 8:14:09 AM PST by twigs
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To: bvw
The U.S. started with great ideals on copyright, but in modern times, we are the ones with effectively infinite terms. Plus we use our muscle to export this, such as recently to Australia. Iraq actually had a decent copyright under Saddam, but now we're about to institute ours I'm sure.
19 posted on 03/04/2004 8:19:33 AM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: LibWhacker
This sounds good to me. They're not owning facts. They're owning collections of facts, subject to fair use. It's just like how the publisher or translator owns the rights to the text of the Bible I use. Their website states:
The ESV text may be quoted (in written, visual, or electronic form) up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing that the verses quoted to not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
Before you whine that the compilers of these databases got the information from somewhere else themselves, remember that they too would be subject to this law, and also that they did all the effort in the sorting and presentation of the data. I wish you guys would find a real news article about this topic, rather than an editorial from Wired....
20 posted on 03/04/2004 8:36:22 AM PST by Styria
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