Campaign mounted to recognize CCW In Federal Parks

TheHighRoad.org ^ | August 21, 2004 | various

[Mulder]

This was posted over on thehighroad.org. Also, Phil VanCleave, head of VCDL, has a thread posted over on packing.org.

There is currently a country wide campaign started this week to get the secretary of the Interior, (who packs herself) to change the policy and let CCW holders in U.S. Parks. Perhaps some of you have read this at Packing.org already. We should continue to contact the Secretary of the Interior, who could make the change without Congress' approval:

Ms. Gale Norton Secretary of the Interior U.S. Department of the Interior Dept. HG, 1849 C Street, NW Washington, DC 20240 Phone: (202) 208-7351 gale_norton@ios.doi.gov

How much do you want to bet that 3,100 emails and phone calls will get her attention?

Suggested email:

Dear Secretary Norton,

The regulations for federal parks need to be revised. Any citizen who is trusted by a state to carry a handgun for self-defense needs to be allowed to carry that handgun in federal parks. This can be accomplished easily using the same mechanism that is used in federal forests: have the park regulations assimilate the host state's firearms laws.

Criminals know no boundaries. Parks, often with remote areas, are not immune from violent crime. My right to defend my life and the lives of my family should not end at an artificial boundary that violent criminals will never respect.

Please let me know what you are going to do to protect my right to self-defense.

Sincerely, [name and address]

[cruiserman]

CCW holders have had training.

Not necessarily true, but irrelevant anyway. Federal law needs to reflect the 2A, not some special state-level hoop to jump through.

[Mulder]

I love this place.

Utah is currently at the top of my list on "retirement" places (I have a long time to go).

My only concern is the availibility of water. Is there enough underground water out there to access with a well?

[glock rocks]

Simple answer, yes. It depends on which area you'd be interested in... and there are a lot of different types of areas here. You can find a spot to be comfy. Anywhere north of Washington county in the south, you'd better have a fondness for snow :o)

[LTCJ]

Not to worry - there is nothing preventing you from carrying in a National Forest as long as the applicable state law doesn't prevent it, IIRC. It's National Parks that have the ban. Not that the disparity ever made any sense. It highlights the power of bureaucrats in the federal government.

[Mulder]

I've lived in the south my entire life, but I think I'd be willing to trade humidity for snow.

Especially since the older I get, the less I want to be close to big cities. I hate cities, and all the crap associated with them.

[Cobra64]

I want to lower the barriers in place for law abiding citizens to get guns, and foster a gun ownership culture that encourages people to take their gun out to a range frequently enough to be a member of a range or club, hell let areas with large population of gun owners set up public gun ranges on public land where citizens can go fire their weapons without paying a range fee.

First of all you just don't "get guns" unless you're in the military, they are bequeathed to you, or you buy one. Second, "Without paying a range fee", well then join the military. Otherwise, who is going to pour a few hundred thousand dollars into setting up a range? The Federal Government? I'd suggest you think through the process before expounding as an expert on weapons ownership. BTW, one of the best civilian home defence weapons is a pump alley sweeper with 000. Do you know what that is? Just chambering a round should make the perp shiite his pants.

[coconutt2000]

Cobra - the semantics of "getting a gun" is not an argument. Besides, in the military they "give you a gun". If you want to "get a gun" you have to... well go and "get" it.

As I said, in areas with a large population of gun owners, they should be able to ask for public land to set up and run a firing range. It is their local tax money, they can figure out if that is a desirable use of their money. I don't think it is likely, but it should be an option.

Is your argument against me just based on the fact that you don't want any government involvement? Fine then. But if you fail to participate and seek compromises with the moderates... You'll find yourself living in a state like Hawaii, where gun ownership is discouraged officially, because if the moderates swing left, your freedoms go with them.

[Hat-Trick]

She up for re-election this year?

[Cobra64]

I love this place.

Me too. Every time Sheinsten and Shoomer open their yaps, I fill my ordnance locker with a new weapon. I'm keying on a Ruger Mini-14 at the moment.

I'd bet that CocoNUTT has never smelled the sweet smell of powder... Or, Hoppes Number 9. When my wife and I went camping in the early 70s, I asked her to use a few dabs of Hoppes instead of perfume. She thought I was nuts! But, we had quite a tumble in the tent...

[Cobra64]

Check out Lake James in NC. Karen and I just finished building a house on Lake James. Crescent Industries is the developer. Lake James has 150 miles of shoreline, fed by three rivers from the Blue Ridge Mountains. 95% of the Lake is gov't or state owned property. It is the clearest/cleanest Lake in NC; and among the most beautiful Lakes in the USA. Do a Google for more deatils. We bought 1.67 acres w/ 400 feet of shoreline in 1999 for $165k. Just finished the house and moved in last April (04). If you want pics, let me know your email address. >

[12.7mm]

Nice thnx

Thats pretty much what I found on packing.org as well. I don't travel that much these days but ya never know. Being state legal in 30 some odd states would be nice. Living under the constitutional law that is a God given right would be better. Instead of all these state laws they impose on us.

But thats the times we live in. At least I don't live chi-town anymore :o)

[12.7mm]

CCW holders have had training. In WA all you have to do is go into the cop shop and pay 60 bucks. Fill a form and give a set prints. As long as your clean and not a fellon. You are good to go. 25-30 bucks renewal fee every 5 years

[Shooter 2.5]

We've had forty years of compromises. I'm through compromising since I've been fighting his stuff since 1982.
We had a liberal president and this time we have a moderate. I hope we keep him and in another four years we get a conservative president. I also hope we have another landslide that keeps the Congress and Senate in pro-gun hands.

As far as Hawaii is concerned, you can always move. I moved out of a liberal state and I know others who did the same.

[cavtrooper21]

You know, I don't know...
2006 - I think.
I suppose I should find out, but it doesn't matter. If I see her name on the ballot I'm voting for the other name, unless it says Nazi or Communist after it.
Of course there wouldn't be much difference.
Our Lady Katie is a Hillary clone to the core.

[B4Ranch]

Please define your thoughts of a "Casual gun owner"

[Living Stone]

The only way one becomes proficient with a handgun and mentally stable enough to handle any emotional situation while carrying it, is to pour several hundred rounds through it. Too many people own guns but don't shoot them enough to become familiar with them. Those are the ones to be afraid of.

Amen brother. We have a public range where I work and about once a day I see something that makes my skin crawl.

I try really hard not to yell at the paying customers, but sometimes, I just have to hoist the black flag...

[Myrddin]

I would hate to be shot by a fellow camper because they were twitchy on the trigger.

Not likely. When I'm "twitchy" on the trigger, I hit the 9 ring instead of the bullseye. I carry at least a 44 mag revolver when I hike around the hills surrounding Pocatello. We have mountain lions and black bears in the area. It is national forest.

I go to Yellowstone National Park once or twice each month. They have mountain lions, black bears and grizzly bears. I would prefer to have my .454 Casull holstered for hikes away from inhabited exhibit areas. When that is allowed, I'll consider hiking in YNP.

I have a CCW for carry in town. The two legged varmints can be handled with a .357 msg.

[B4Ranch]

The reason why the management in Big Bend is saying,
>>"The Rio Grande is NOT a national border, but only a feature of the landscape."<<
is because the control of the National Park System is under the United Nations. The United Nations does not recognize 'national borders'.

I'm not going to edit this again as I posted it for http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1195311/posts?page=38#38 a couple of days ago. Just click on one of the park names and see where you are redirected.

Not everyone understands what the AWB is but they do know what a National Park is, so let me use the National Parks System as an example of what OUR Republican Congressmen and women have given away to UN control without a word to us! (Remember the people who make the rules for our freedoms inside these Parks are appointed not elected. That's the way the UN works things.)

I have watched and protested as our sustainable development supporting Republican legislators aided the Democrats in giving control of the land in our National Parks, Preserves and Monuments, World Heritage Site, Biosphere Reserves as designated by the UN to the United Nations.

This involves 68% of public land in ! Yet we cannot get American citizens to stand up together and say, "STOP!"

(Um just how many Americans do you think are actually willing to fight for OUR 2nd Amendment when they won't even bother about Yellowstone)

Some of the land I'm referring to is:

USA	UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
1	Aleutian Islands	1976
2	Big Bend	1976
3	Cascade Head	1976
4	Central Plains	1976
5	Channel Islands	1976
6	Coram	1976
7	Denali	1976
8	Desert	1976
9	Everglades & Dry Tortugas	1976
10	Fraser	1976
11	Glacier	1976
12	H.J. Andrews	1976
13	Hubbard Brook	1976
14	Jornada	1976
15	Luquillo	1976
16	Noatak	1976
17	Olympic	1976
18	Organ Pipe Cactus	1976
19	Rocky Mountain	1976
20	San Dimas	1976
21	San Joaquin	1976
22	Sequoia-Kings Canyon	1976
23	Stanislaus-Tuolumne	1976
24	Three Sisters	1976
25	Virgin Islands	1976
26	Yellowstone	1976
27	Beaver Creek	1976
28	Konza Prairie	1978
29	Niwot Ridge	1979
30	University of Michigan Biological Station	1979
31	Virginia Coast	1979
32	Hawaiian Islands	1980
33	Isle Royale	1980
34	Big Thicket	1981
35	Guanica	1981
36	California Coast Ranges	1983
37	Central Gulf Coast Plain	1983
38	South Atlantic Coastal Plain	1983
39	Mojave and Colorado Deserts	1984
40	Carolinian-South Atlantic	1986
41	Glacier Bay-Admiralty Is.	1986
42	Golden Gate	1988
43	New Jersey Pinelands	1988
44	Southern Appalachian	1988
45	Champlain-Adirondak	1989
46	Mammoth Cave Area	1990	1996 (extended)
47	Land Between The Lakes	1991

These are the most treasured parks in our country! But our elected REPUBLICAN officials didn't have a problem turning control over to the 191 Member States of the United Nations.

Tell me what interests should Iraq, Iran and Sudan have in you visiting our National Parks.

[KrisKrinkle]

Just how do you propose ensuring responsible gun ownership and use?

How about swift, certain repercussions for irresponsible gun ownership and use?

[Apogee]

I believe that Nat'l parks and Nat'l Forests are governened differently, IIRC according to the Forestry info people I spoke with re carrying in Pisgah, state laws apply in the Forest. Parks are another matter.
If you look up info on line, there seems to be some room for some carry in a manner that is not immediately accessible - but it is not certain how an individual officer may interpret that.
http://www.nps.gov/pub_aff/e-mail/weapons.htm

I found deep in a federal website once the idea that one could have a firearm for protection in ones camp, but no real provision for how to get it there. Can't find that tonight in the time alloted.

Does TN require a permit for open carry? Spending a lot of time there, I would like to know. Thanks