Posted on 10/15/2005 10:30:55 AM PDT by sageb1
TOLEDO, Ohio (AP) - Police used tear gas to break up a rock-throwing crowd that had gathered to protest a planned march Saturday by the National Socialist Movement.
At least two dozen members of a Roanoke, Va.-based group that calls itself "America's Nazi Party" had gathered at Wilson Park just before noon and were to march under police protection.
(Excerpt) Read more at nbc24.com ...
When we find a legal way to do it.
"They knew this would happen ..." that is exactly the issue that needs to be changed.
It must not be an almost accepted response by the ethnic group to repond to situations they do not like with violence. It must not be tolerated. For everyones' benefit - most especially theirs.
What hurts worse than the racism is the low self expectations.
your condescending attitude is silly. I think you have alot to learn. This site is about more than just taking a side and digging in. I wish you the best of luck but do not address me again because I find you offensive and obnoxious. This is the first time that I have asked someone not to address me. I will turn you in if you do address me.
Exactly. Our closet- and not-so-closet-authoritarians here think that just because "someone is making trouble" that therefore the government has a right to silence them. Not so. There have to be dire, immediate, imminent threats before one can claim that speech has to be silenced to prevent violence. None of that applies here. What we have is a "just so" way of looking at the world: the Nazis are bad people, bad people cause bad things, the world would be better off without them, therefore silence them "for the greater good". But the First Amendment was not written to promote "the greater good" as defined by authoritarians: it was written to shackle the arbitrary power of those in authority. No one wants to censor speech they agree with. It is precisely the unpopular speech that was intended to be protected by the First Amendment.
Communists vs nazi's,same old with them, they hate each other and we just give them both a voice.Commies are at the gate and nazi's are a powerless strawman for our lib commies hehe.
Again, libel, sedition, slander, etc.
Are there different Nazis than WWII?
Is it like the Gold Star Mothers and the Gold Star Families for Peace?
I don't think so. They're Nazis, period.
IMHO, it is.
You are are absolutely correct. These rioters didn't feel threatened by the "Nazis." The thought is absurb. They probably were outraged, but if they examined this group which seems to combine historical re-enactment with a creative fantasy element I think their outrage would have considerably been lessened by their laughter.
Actually, we DID get some-don't know how many, though.
Oh, sure, and who defines those limits? You, me, some dem appointed judge? Sorry, it is not that simple.
In thinking about this today, I wonder if the first amendment even assumes a certain level of personal responsibility that would have been a given in its time. There were certain things that would be said or not said in a given situation - for instance - the whole "yelling fire in a theatre" would not even occur tothe framers - "who would do that?" they would think - I wonder.
For instance, the Nazis of today's discussion would be responsible - not just for one day but within society for a long time - for what they said (or would have said, given the chance).
To others who may be reading - I apologize if I offended anyone. But the issue is personal responsibility. And non-race based expectations of appropriate behaviour.
Unfortunately, it worked.
That's what we're looking at here. Unfortunately, the 'incite to riot' is harder to prove then the obvious televised effect. Either behavior is criminal and should be treated as such. As the stories filter down it seems there has been a substantial amount of pot stirring on both sides of the fence here. If the skinheads planned to abuse an interpretation of free speech to incite a riot, they should be locked up. And the thugs who threw rocks, burned bars, accosted gas station attendants, and damaged public property should all be arrested too. I think Lucas County Jail should suffer a sell-out crowd (as a figure of speech...)
Now, having said that, what are the bets? Well, since it will take work on the part of the Lucas Co. Prosecutor to build a conspiracy to incite riot case, I'm not holding my breath on that. On the other side, a minimal few of the thugs (probably those who got caught full face on TV) will be charged with anything at all (those cases requiring the least amount of work by the LuCo Prosecutor). Since no one will in essence have to suffer the consequences of their faulty decision processes, the only real thing that will be accomplished is ensurring that the same thing will happen again...
Sort of like our lack of response to the first WTC bombing guaranteed the repeat... Now, if the LuCo Prosecutor and Ronnie Earle get together, maybe they can get Rove indicted for this... yeah, that's the ticket... /sarc
"Yes, even "nazi speech" is protected."
That is the mainstream view, but does the language and intent of the 1st Amendment necessarily require it?
Some forms of speech can be prohibited. For instance, threats against some public figures are criminal.
Seems to me that it would be within the strictures of the Constitution to ban the Nazi Party, given its history.
Sorry, wrong.... libel, slander are punishable.
Deal with it yourself....the Nazi's did not have a permit to march.
I think you're missing the point.
Put up or shut up?
Who 'egged' the rioters on?
I'm glad I don't live next to you in Toledo. Sounds like you'd welcome the Nazis with open arms, no matter the cost to my family.
I remember those days in Toledo. Everyone knew everyone else and had your parents phone number. Neighbors watched out for one another and the kids. I miss it.
The real question is - why does it take Nazis from Roanoke to draw attention?
I have enough split ends, thanks.
Let me put it another way...
I never thought I'd see an American tolerate Nazis.
"Free speech IS offensive speech,and protected by law.Restricting anothers' right to speak offensively because it is presumed to cause a violent offensive reaction in others is illegal and unconstitutional."
Tell it to Jane and John.
"The people in that neighborhood who had been victimised by crime for years went to the cops and got no protection,they didnt belong to the correct victim group.They reached out to someone willing to make a public statement about it.Today we see the result."
You know for a fact the people in that neighborhood reached out to the Nazis. Hmmmmm.
bubububutttt. Jane and John will fight for Islam's right to free speech. What a quagmire.
I hope so. Toledo said they intend to view tape and there will be more arrests. I hope so.
I've been reading stuff I Googled. I've freepmailed it to some. It's stuff I can't post on FR but if anyone wants to know the whole of this, it's there to read. Knights
Knews Knetwork (michiganklanboyz) had a hand in this too. I'm not believing what I'm seeing!
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.