Large Hadron Collider rival Tevatron 'has found Higgs boson'

Telegraph ^ | June 12th, 2010 | Tom Chivers

[TaraP]

Rumours are emerging from the rival to the Large Hadron Collider that the Higgs boson, or so-called "God particle", has been found.

Tommaso Dorigo, a physicist at the University of Padua, has said in his blog that there has been talk coming out of the Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory in Batavia, Illinois, that the Higgs has been discovered.

The Tevatron, the huge particle accelerator at Fermi - the most powerful in the world after the LHC - is expected to be retired when the CERN accelerator becomes fully operational, but may have struck a final blow before it becomes obsolete.

If one form of the rumour is to be believed - and Prof Dorigo is extremely circumspect about it - then it is a "three-sigma" signature, meaning that there is a statistical likelihood of 99.7 per cent that it is correct. But, of course, that is only if the rumour is to be believed.

In the post, titled "Rumors about a light Higgs", Prof Dorigo said: "It reached my ear, from two different, possibly independent sources, that an experiment at the Tevatron is about to release some evidence of a light Higgs boson signal.

"Some say a three-sigma effect, others do not make explicit claims but talk of a unexpected result."

[E8crossE8]

When you get mathematically close to a Black Hole, or Singularity in space, all the known laws of physics break down. All the equations come out to = infinity. Whether it is a physicist or a theoretical mathematician, this breakdown of laws such as E=MC2 gives them migraines. The presence of the Higgs Boson would fix those problems, but until its proven to exist, its all theory.

So if this is correct, and it has been found, then Physicists will be able to fully describe creation mathematically. Possibly even be able to tell us what the universe was like BEFORE the big bang. Let’s just say, its been the missing piece to the puzzle.

The experimental discovery of the Higgs boson will have nothing whatsoever to do with addressing any issues relevant to spacetime singularities. The Higgs boson is a postulated elementary particle that is part of the spectrum of particles in the so-called Standard Model (the Weinberg-Salam model). It is a so-called "scalar," "spin-zero" particle that plays an important role in the dynamics of the Standard Model, in that its presence in the spectrum enables particles that would otherwise be massless to exhibit a non-vanishing mass (at scales of energy of interaction that are less than what is called the "electroweak symmetry breaking scale," which is about 256 MeV/c^2). The monikers "spin zero" and "scalar," in this context, mean that the Higgs particle has no intrinsic, quantum mechanical angular momentum.

Spacetime singularities arise as mathematical characteristics of certain solutions to the differential equations of motion in both the general theory of relativity ("GR," which is a classical mechanical theory) and in certain proposed quantum mechanical generalizations of GR, such as string theory. These mathematical singularities in certain solutions appear due to particular aspects of both the differential equations of motion and the boundary conditions imposed on the solutions to them, and have nothing to do with the fact that there is a Higgs boson in the Standard Model. The original, default Standard Model is defined in flat spacetime, without gravitational interactions and with no graviton in the spectrum. In contrast, spacetime singularities, such as those associated with certain black hole solutions to GR, appear in theories defined on a curved spacetime with massless, spin-two particles (such as the graviton) in the particle spectrum. The presence or absence of the Higgs boson in the particle spectrum of the Standard Model is independent of the presence or absence of singular solutions to the equations of motion in general relativity.

[musicman]

[E8crossE8]

256 MeV/c^2 is, of course, the mass associated to the electroweak scale - the actual electroweak energy scale is just 256 MeV.

[sionnsar]

I found Cheryl Higgins’ bosom once. Does that count?

Was hers light or heavy? *\;-)

[StormEye]

" The one on the right is blonde? *\;-)

(Or are you saying it's a he?)"

I don't understand you're post. Are saying that I misspelled the word blond? The word blond doesn't have an "e" on the end of it. And I wasn't "saying" anything. I was only asking if anyone knew the name of the blond woman on the right side of the photo. I couldn't recall her name.

[E8crossE8]

So if this is correct, and it has been found, then Physicists will be able to fully describe creation mathematically.

It would be nice if this were true, but, alas, even if/once the Higgs boson is discovered, we will remain far from being able to mathematically describe creation. Discovery of the Higgs would confirm the correctness of the Standard Model, but the Standared Model has a very specific, limited range of applicability. It ceases to provide reliable predictive capability (for known reasons) at a certain magnitude of energy of interaction below the so-called Planck scale, which is the interaction scale at which quantum mechanical corrections to general relativity become important (the Planck scale is many orders of magnitude larger than the electroweak symmetry breaking scale). Moreover, there are some 17 parameters in the Standard Model, the values of which must be specified "by hand," in order to calculate answers to the questions we ask, such as to figure out what are called "scattering amplitudes." These 17 parameter values will not be explained by the discovery of the Higgs. (There is some hope that they may be explained within String Theory.)

Furthermore, the Standard Model, strictly defined, doesn't describe the physics of quarks and gluons: that physics is described by a different theory (called quantum chromodynamics), and various combinations of both the Standard Model and QCD (such theories are called "grand unified theories") have been worked out to account for the physics of the known particles, with the exception of gravitation. Properly melding together gravitation and quantum mechanics remains today an unsolved problem (although String Theory is a strong candidate approach), and the discovery of the Higgs, sadly, won't solve this problem.

[wxgesr]

Wow, what are you a rocket scientist or sumptin? Good reply.

[adorno]

I'm a proton guy myself, but, I once was on the neutron side.

[E8crossE8]

Wow, what are you a rocket scientist or sumptin? Good reply.

Nope, just a theoretical particle physicist who, like you, doesn't want to be forced to eat "gubmint cheese" (found that on your profile, and I wholeheartedly agree).

[valkyry1]

//I once was on the neutron side//

And that is a hard side to be on.

Proton’s? I’m gamma ray kinda guy :-)

[valkyry1]

//the discovery of the Higgs, sadly, won’t solve this problem//

Why is that a sad thing?

[E8crossE8]

//the discovery of the Higgs, sadly, won’t solve this problem//

Why is that a sad thing?

Good point - you got me there. I should have written that it would be sad for me, and sad for my colleagues. In fact, it's probably a good thing, as it means there remains a lot of work to perform. ;)

[valkyry1]

Put you on the spot did I? :-)

[Robert A Cook PE]

First rule of writing any research paper: The last line of the paper must include “ ... and further research is required.”

[Nik Naym]

I wonder if they will next search for the Boson’s Mate?

[Captain Beyond]

bflr

[valkyry1]

I am not a physicist but I grasp the concepts of physics.

Let me tell you something, your job/work in physics is secure, in fact it will extend onto infinity.

Keep up the good work.

Regards,

[tlb]

>>> Like the movie Contact. A second unknown site built.

Not quite since the smaller Collidor pre-dated and was distinct from the new facility. But “Why buy one when you can buy two at twice the price” is still a good rule of thumb.

For example, how many people realize there are two multi-billion dollar Shuttle launch facilities, with one that is never referred to at Vandenberg.

[E8crossE8]

I am not a physicist but I grasp the concepts of physics.

Let me tell you something, your job/work in physics is secure, in fact it will extend onto infinity.

Keep up the good work.

Regards,

Thanks for the comment. As a physicist I feel quite secure as such. I wish I could also feel secure about the country as a whole. However, given the Obominable mis-administration of Obozo ...

[Danae]

I don’t disagree with you. Clearly you understand the mathematics far better than I do.

The difference may just lay in the difference between seeing a propeller spin so fast you can’t see the blades, and taking a snapshot of it, because then you can perceive an instant of time that allows you to perceive reality... which is reality more than meets the eye.

Higgs is that snapshot I believe.