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To: Carry_Okie

The listed first offense penalty is for just property damage. I fully support the summary roadside execution of anyone found intoxicated (whether on booze or drugs) at the scene of a fatal or injury accident they caused. Which goes one better than your idea, I note.

I would also point out that we still have laws on the books requiring those so sentenced to labor until the fine is paid. And we always have new ditches that need digging, etc., etc. Welcome to the new WPA, here’s your shovel, you’re working under military discipline until you pay off your fine, have a nice day.

Further, I’d point out that you still have all these problems *already* what with all the drug laws we already have. What’s your solution for the illegal drug users’ multigenerational damage, lack of insurance, etc.? Remember, this is already going on NOW with them fully illegal at the Federal and state levels - so what’s your plan for dealing with it?

Another point is that you seem to be confusing me with someone who wishes drugs to be legalized everywhere. I don’t. I can’t see any justification in the Constitution for it to be regulated *at the Federal level*. The states should determine if they wish to allow or ban such substances. Powers reserved to the states and the people, you know.


32 posted on 11/18/2013 10:06:53 AM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Spktyr
I fully support the summary roadside execution of anyone found intoxicated (whether on booze or drugs) at the scene of a fatal or injury accident they caused. Which goes one better than your idea, I note.

No, it doesn't. Do that and you'll have invented a new form of murder. It doesn't allow for forced intoxication, date rape drugs, or other causes meant to get someone put away.

What’s your solution for the illegal drug users’ multigenerational damage, lack of insurance, etc.? Remember, this is already going on NOW with them fully illegal at the Federal and state levels - so what’s your plan for dealing with it?

I note that you didn't include lifelong damage to babies. You should take a walk through a newborn intensive care unit some time. My wife works in one. The horror stories she has to tell would give you pause about the idea of "victimless crime." The cost is greater than many users could repay in an entire lifetime.

The point is in terms of this discussion that the costs of immoral behavior are NOT confined to the individual. The same thing is true of gay and lesbian marriage. The intergenerational costs are enormous, especially when one considers the likely epigenetic implications. This is where libertarianism as distinguished from conservatism breaks down.

I'm afraid it's going to take an array of solutions beyond the obvious already mentioned. An advertising campaign about the damage to babies and innocents would help. Strong penalties such as I have described would help. VERY stiff penalties for giving or selling drugs to minors would help. In short, I think we agree that focusing upon punishing the damage done by users should displace penalties for possession and sale along with medical treatment for those wishing to stop. We agree about shovels and weeds, but I would prefer more targeted restitution, employment with a charity set up for such services for example would be a good start, but the problems of fraud would be a real problem there. I'm afraid that validation services with good statistical metrics are almost nonexistent. It will take time.

I can’t see any justification in the Constitution for it to be regulated *at the Federal level*.

We agree about Federalism but for one thing: The borders. Sink any boat or shoot down any plane crossing the border that won't identify itself and allow inspection. Similarly, take possession of any car used for smuggling those supplies that have not paid their taxes and or insurance. If nothing else, I'm not a 'free trader' when it comes to recreational drugs.

Unfortunately, confining regulation of the drug trade to states would be a smuggler's dream, again because of the spread between the cost of production and the cost of risk. Should any State try to internalize those costs or should substantial disparities exist in taxation or insurance, there would immediately be a black market between States with all the resulting border problems we see with Mexico. The resulting police state would likely be worse than ever. So be careful with that thought.

33 posted on 11/18/2013 10:33:49 AM PST by Carry_Okie ("Single payer" is Medicaid for all; they'll pull the sheet over your head when you're done.)
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