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1 posted on 08/29/2016 12:12:44 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
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To: sukhoi-30mki
This article provides yet another occasion to raise the question, on a cost benefit analysis, is the United States more secure or less secure for its support of Israel?


2 posted on 08/29/2016 12:21:54 AM PDT by nathanbedford
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To: sukhoi-30mki
Seems the documents were from 1984 the war ended in 1982.
Was there an international agreement to lay siege to Argentina? I don't remember anything like that. it would have been stupid if they did.

Seems like a non-issue.

4 posted on 08/29/2016 12:30:39 AM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric Cartman voice* 'I love you, guys')
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To: sukhoi-30mki
Maybe I am wrong but Argentina and Israel seem an odd pair.

Argentina having been a safe harbor for Nazis fleeing Europe after WW II.

But arms dealing make strange bedfellows (to slaughter a phrase)

8 posted on 08/29/2016 12:41:04 AM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: sukhoi-30mki
Timeline seems odd:

The British government's National Archives department released the files dated November 16, 1984, which include a memorandum from a senior British diplomat who provided details on the Israeli arms sales to Argentina, the London-based Telegraph reported Wednesday.

“Israel was one of the few countries to supply Argentina with arms during the Falklands conflict and has continued to do so,” wrote C.W. Long, the UK Foreign Office's then head of the Near East and North Africa region, in one of the documents.

The now disclosed files further substantiate claims made in a book published in 2011 that purported to expose Israel's armament of General Leopoldo Galtieri's Argentine junta forces by secretly routing weapons shipments to Buenos Aires via Peru. In his book Operation Israel, Argentine journalist Hernan Dobry wrote of the Israeli weapons sales during the war and Jerusalem's denial at the time of such actions.

The newly-released files that list evidence cited by British diplomats also reportedly note that Israel provided military equipment, including bomber jets, to Argentina's junta prior to the war and continued with the exports for years thereafter.

The declassified records add that Israel was prepared to sell espionage aircraft to the junta, and that former British foreign secretary Geoffrey Howe had called for the exchange not to be implemented.

However, the logs show that Long believed that Israel would pay no heed to the British request.

“I do not believe the Israelis are to be moved on this issue,” the Telegraph quoted him as writing. “This is not satisfactory, but Israeli interests in Argentina will outweigh any readiness they might otherwise feel to be helpful to us.”

At the time, ties were strained between allies Britain and Israel over the First Lebanon War while charges emerged that then Israeli prime minister Menachem Begin had approved the weapons' supply to Argentina.

The Argentine military dictatorship, or junta, that ruled at the time faced increased opposition following their defeat in the ten-week conflict over the sovereignty of the Falkland islands, and relinquished power the next year in 1983.

"Just prior" to the 10-week (1982) war, the junta relinquished power in 1983, and continued providing (a different Argentinian government) arms years later (1984).

9 posted on 08/29/2016 12:42:35 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (Obama is more supportive of Iran's right to defend its territorial borders than he is of the USA's.)
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To: sukhoi-30mki; nathanbedford

Any country which is drowning in debt of $20 TRILLION = $63,492 debt for every man, woman & child, has no business aiding anyone. Take care of your own first! OTOH if we had a surplus in the Treasury, Israel should be at the top of list for aid.


12 posted on 08/29/2016 1:00:03 AM PDT by entropy12 (Majority of Politicians are either Globalists pushing cheap labor express or are Neocons.)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

The US under hussein gave weapons to isis and al queda. Which is worse?


13 posted on 08/29/2016 1:02:29 AM PDT by Eagles6 ( Valley Forge Redux. If not now, when? If not here, where? If not us then who?)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Israel was perhaps paying back the Brits for their relentless attacks against their nation from 1947-49 by the Labour government. In any case this was/is between those two nations, not us, but the UK, in league with assorted Arab nations, nearly killed of Israel in its infancy.


14 posted on 08/29/2016 1:02:45 AM PDT by LongWayHome
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Odd. The UK has been such a staunch ally to Israel. /s


18 posted on 08/29/2016 3:32:00 AM PDT by Flag_This (Liberals are locusts.)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Recent UK “Blood Money” http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/blood-money-uk-s-123bn-arms-sales-to-repressive-states-8711794.html


19 posted on 08/29/2016 3:59:57 AM PDT by outofsalt ( If history teaches us anything it's that history rarely teaches us anything)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Based on their administration of the Palestine Mandate, the forcible barring of post-Holocaust survivors landing there, the British Establishment’s well known anti-Semitism, and the dominance of Arabists in Whitehall, can somebody explain to me why the Israelis should not have pulled the lion’s tail when they got the chance? We have, or used to have, a special relationship with Britain. Israel’s relationship with her is a lot less “special”.


24 posted on 08/29/2016 4:43:37 AM PDT by katana
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To: sukhoi-30mki

sadly it seems whatever we give them eventually they transfer to the Chinese.

if you raise one little peep about it then you’re a Nazi.

how do you help Israel but avoid ending up fighting your own precious equipment..?

the UK is and has always been a good friend of Israel, yet one of the favorite stories in Israel is the one about the Scorpion and the Frog.

they might as well tell the story about themselves.


29 posted on 08/29/2016 5:29:18 AM PDT by gaijin
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To: sukhoi-30mki

That whole Falklands war was a fiasco if I remember. I few Argentine dug in , fly overs on a couple paltry fishing islands with the whole bloody Brit fleet bombing that rock. As this is post Falklands seems to be a non issue, maybe Aergentina restocking for their next fishing rights war.


30 posted on 08/29/2016 5:36:25 AM PDT by Karliner (Jeremiah29:11,Romans8:28-end, this is the end of the beginning WinstonChurchill)
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To: sukhoi-30mki
For those interested in the continuation of the story, here is a good article about Argentine's present efforts to modernize its airforce.

Two to Tango? Argentina Looking Everywhere for New Warplanes

Some noteworthy passages:

Britain’s defenses are also much more run down than they were in the 1980s, and their complete lack of a carrier force leaves ongoing protection of the islands’ surrounding economic zones to just 2-4 Eurofighter Typhoon fighters, an offshore patrol vessel, and part of a regular navy ship rotation. Argentina’s window of opportunity will close when Britain’s advanced carrier force enters service in 2020, which has added urgency on both sides as Argentina tries to make a deal. Can Argentina find its partner?

[ SNIP ]

The good news for Britain, such as it is, is that Argentina still has to hang weapons on any fighters they buy. The FAA must either stick with their existing set of old equipment and forego most of the new fighter’s potential, or buy new weapons from the USA or Israel. Any new weapon sales would be a double escalation, making those sales less likely. The most dangerous Kfir-related sale, of Gabriel 3 anti-ship missiles, would make Britain an outright enemy of Israel’s. That won’t happen.

[ SNIP ]

Swedish JAS-39 Gripen fighters are the subject of talks with Brazil, but they use American F414 engines and British Martin-Baker ejection seats, to name only the most difficult substitutions. Indeed, about 30% of those planes are traceable to British firms – and Britain has stated that they will block such exports. The only sources free of American or European influence are Russia and China.

34 posted on 08/29/2016 6:08:51 AM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: sukhoi-30mki
Argentine US-built A-4C Skyhawk:

Argentine US-built LVTP-7 in Port Stanley, Falklands:


36 posted on 08/29/2016 6:28:08 AM PDT by PLMerite (Compromise is Surrender: The Revolution...will not be kind.)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

IMO, Israel looks to it’s own interests first and ignores the complaints of others.

Something we should emulate.


37 posted on 08/29/2016 9:16:40 AM PDT by Oatka (Beware of an old man in a profession where men usually die young.)
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