If a heterosexual comes into a Christian bakery and asks for a “wedding cake” for two homosexual friends, and the baker refuses to make it for him, then how exactly is the baker engaging in any kind of discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation?
I absolutely HATE where this conversation is going. Now we’re flirting with the idea that discrimination against “gays” may not be kosher, but against events only.
This could have been a landmark case to bust open the fascist nature of “anti-discrimination” laws as they apply to private businesses and associations, but they won’t go there. What a tragically lost opportunity.
> one of the all-time greats of the conservative movement, George Will <
Well, at least the author has a sense of humor.
Will’s a fool as has been proven over and over again.
These bakers need to come up with a different reason for not making these cakes. And then, if forced, add a little something to the batter. (In fact, gay websites always warn their brethren of this possibility.)
Anyway, I think there is a big Catch-22 in all of this--what is a business allowed to do or not do? The cake shop, Twitter, Facebook, your local Internet provider, etc. Shall all be able to impose their viewpoint on others? Thus, no conservative on the Internet, no conservative "right to refuse service" at the cake shop? While I agree that the cake shop, the wedding photographer, and others have right to refuse service, we need to reconcile this with the same right of Twitter and Facebook to refuse service. Same with Internet Service Providers that choose not to deliver certain URL addresses (heck, they might based on our desire for the cake shop, apply the same to block FR). That is the challenge, how do we apply personal rights to commercial entities. I think the only way is to say that commercial entities don't have 1st amendment rights of their owners, they are privileged organizations and have public responsibility.
Substitute "house" for "cake," and "Frank Lloyd Wright" for "Jack Phillips." Does Will's argument still hold up?
Clearly, a house is primarily for dwelling, so why are Wright's houses so famous?
-PJ
George Will is “Willfully Ignorant” in this matter.
He knows damn well that Mike had sold product to these guys many times before.
There is NO legal compulsion for him to participate in a fraudulent ceremony.
I had my fill of Will after his book "Pursuit of Virtue and Other Tory Notions" came out in the 80s. It wasn't the book per se. It was that shortly after the book came out that it was revealed he was banging some bimbo on the side.
He divorced his wife, dumping her, leaving her with three kids to raise including one with Down's syndrome.
Call me old fashioned but I find it rather unsavory to be pushing a book on the virtues of virtue, while engaging in a personal life that was quite the opposite.
George Will is usually always wrong.
Problem George - they offer to sell their bake goods to anyone - there’s just some messages they will not utilize their artistic abilities to create.......I bet they would also refuse to put, “All faggots should eat $#!+ and die” on a cake too....
George Will is usually wrong.
I could see a baker choosing to specialize in exclusively creating cakes celebrating homosexual unions and issues. Would there be any clamor or outrage if that baker subsequently refused to expand his specialty to include cakes intended to celebrate actual marriage?
Cake is food. Icing is food. But design and the skill to decorate a cake beautifully = artistic expression. If not true then bake a cake and sell them the unassembled cake and icing and anyone can put it together since it is just food. A painting is just paint and paper then? George, ever hear of gestalt? The whole is greater than the sum of its parts.
Sounds like we’re going to have to get some people to run around San Francisco asking businesses to bake Confederate flag and swastika cakes.
Its not the states place to conscript anyone. I’d argue that it shouldn’t be able to even do that for military service. We are either a free nation or not. It doesn’t mean we are free to do whatever we want or demand whatever we want from others compelling them against their will. Consent is the founding principle of this nation. Its better to tolerate bigotry than to institute slavery in the name of combating it and by tolerating I don’t mean passively accepting. There will always be the freedom to protest perceived bigotry.
What the George Will’s of the world want to do is allow the federal government to use the heavy hand of the state to FORCE acceptance of homosexuality and the promotion of it. MSNBC can refuse to run pro life commercials but a cake baker can’t refuse to make cakes with a pro ssm message. It is exactly the same thing and no matter how much I think MSNBC not allowing paid ads for Pro Life messages they don’t like is awful I fully support their right to be awful.
The LGBT movement has been one of the most anti liberty big state movements in history. They are not demanding liberty from the state but liberty to control others through edicts that force adoration of them and their depravity. Religious liberty and further more freedom of conscience are the keystones to stopping dead this movement. One more Conservative Supreme Court Justice and Religious liberty will be unassailable and this depraved group can be shoved firmly back into their gutter where they belong.
viz,
If a heterosexual comes into a Christian bakery and asks for a “wedding cake” for two homosexual friends, the baker should tell him:
“Tell your mother to bake you a queer cake coz she knows how to make queer things in her oven.”
George need to take a sabbatical and go away into some wilderness and not come back until President Trump has finished his second term.
Then, he would have to have two vows:
1. Never write anything!
2. A vow of silence for the rest of his life!
In the meantime, George take a hike and tell your lies to the DC swamp people, you slither around with.
Suppose a baker or a printer is gay and is asked to provide services for an event promoting traditional marriage. Is it OK for that baker or printer to say no?
Will is a self-described “amiable, low voltage atheist.”
Which now sounds an awful lot like “moderate Muslim”, as far as his tolerance of other religions goes.