Posted on 10/28/2018 1:05:39 PM PDT by Hostage
Members who have dependents usually have the option of living on-base in the military family housing for free, or off-base and receive a monthly housing allowance. Members who are assigned to locations where dependents are not allowed to travel at government expense (such as basic training, and some unaccompanied overseas assignments) can live in the barracks for free, and still continue to receive the housing allowance (for the location of their dependents), in order to provide a household for their family members.
At some bases, members may not have a choice. When I was stationed at Edwards Air Force Base, in California, all First Sergeants and many commanders were required by local regulation to live on-base. It is because the Wing Commander wanted his senior leadership readily available at all times. The closest livable off-base town is Lancaster, which is about 45 miles away from the main base.
I made E-5 in three years so it's safe to assume that had I made a career in the Army, I would have at least made E-8 after 34 years of service. In today's wages, that E-8 is now making about 15K more than I was when I retired in 2006.
And if any of my military time was in a combat zone, it would have been tax free with an additional $225 per month as well as additional benefits for my family.
Add to that, free healthcare for me and my family as compared to what I was paying to my employer and still paying for my secondary coverage.
As a side note, I spent last Easter at my niece's house for dinner and was privileged to meet her neighbor who was a 44 year old Lt. Colonel with 24 years of service with the Army Corps of Engineers..........
A Lt. Colonel with over 20 years of service is currently making a base pay of over $108K.........That's pretty darn good money..........
You can insult all you want.
The fact is that military pay is low compared to the civilian sector. That and what to do about it is what we’re talking about here. What you’re talking is anyone’s guess. Maybe you’re a mortgage broker or have a close relative that is one? Figures.
LOL! You’re the one who is being insulting. I have more faith in our fighting men and women to make wise financial decisions than you do.
Yep, officer ranks with many years of experience can net some good pay but it’s still less than counterparts in the civilian sector. Still, it’s enough to get a home or acreage out or beyond the burbs.
We’re talking about enlisted and junior officers and how they have to cope.
Example:
Insurance Broker with 20 years experience is making on the low end about $175k per year. Compare that with senior officer pay with 20 years.
Top engineers make $150k with 10 years.
Certified IT pros make $125k with just three years.
An imported IT worker from say India can make $70k but that’s another story.
Against the civilian sector, enlisted and junior officers get demolished if they need to live outside the base in high-cost areas.
Before Bush 41, military families had more benefits because of on-base living and education. But that was cut greatly starting with Bush 41.
Rather than blow a hole in the federal budget by raising military pay to be competitive with civilian pay, there is a better solution to build housing on-base for families and let them save.
No you don’t.
“The fact is that military pay is low compared to the civilian sector. “
It used to be many years ago but not today, far from it.
An E-3 with just two years service pulls in $47,304 in pay and housing for living in Colorado. That doesn’t include the over $15,000 in medical benefits. Toss that in, and that 20 year E-3 makes over $60,000 compared to civilians.
Where does a 20 year old get that kind of pay in the civil sector??
Life's unfair. Live it, love it, learn it.
Project your low opinion of our brave fighting men and women on someone else. I'm out.
> “An E-3 with just two years service pulls in $47,304 in pay and housing for living in Colorado.”
Huh? The operative phrase is “and housing” which is quite scarce on military bases for E-3. It’s not a sure thing and is like not a thing at all.
Most E-3s are not having families yet. It’s the military families that are victims to predatory loan sharks and they are compelled to make ends meet with debt because their pay is too low when living in the civilian sector.
An E3 with two years of experience earns a salary of $23,173.
https://work.chron.com/much-active-duty-soldiers-make-22371.html
You data appear to be absurd. Not criticizing you but it seems like a typo or someone’s far-fetched fantasy data analysis.
Tens of thousands of Service Member families on Food Stamps (Aug 2017)
http://americanhomefront.wunc.org/post/how-many-military-families-need-food-assistance-pentagon-doesnt-know
There are all sorts of finance/money management classes available, along with other life skill classes like keeping a resume up to date. The classes are not usually mandatory, but some commands do require some or all lower enlisted to attend. When it is not mandatory few attend the class. It also seems those that need the classes the most are those that tend to skip it.
I have had family in the military all my life and it seems to me it worked better for lower enlisted to live in military housing. They are young, and easily led into even a rental they can’t afford. As they gain rank their pay goes up so that it is easier for them to rent or buy a decent house they can afford.
Honestly what I see the lower enlisted doing now is renting the cheapest apartment they can find so they can have the difference between the rent and their BAH to spend on other things. The cheap apartment is usually small, in a not nice area, and not maintained so that leads to family stress too.
“Some commands have in the past required its members to attend credit and financial counseling.”
My GF’s son graduated from AF Basic this past March and has taken a couple of finance courses on base. One was mandatory the other optional.
Only lived in base housing twice - not counting 5 years as a barracks rat. 6 months at Ft Bliss and two years at Ft Campbell. Much preferred living of post.
Lower ranking enlisted members don’t seem to have a problem getting a house. Payments get strained when that $40K truck and $35K SUV roll into the driveway pulling a $30K boat.
You were talking about mortgage loans, so you cannot remove the housing allowance from that equation.
I spent 24 years in the army, about 5 of those years in command. I found that “dumb” cut across just about all ranks. Financial troubles were common with younger enlisted soldiers. Many made incredibly stupid purchases. For officers the dumb moves were almost always related to adultery. Saw many a career ruined because guys couldn’t keep it in their pants. The universal truth of command was that 10% of your soldiers took up 90% of your time due to their poor decisions/behavior.
“Tens of thousands of Service Member families on Food Stamps (Aug 2017)”
No one in the military qualifies in Colorado. $14,000 income limit. Some States might have lower qualifications.
Fact is, just how irresponsible are you to have children you cannot afford to feed?
I don’t want to hear about 18, 19, 20, and 21 year olds that aren’t living the high life.
You sound like a liberal demanding minimum standards of living.
I don’t know what service you were in, but the Air Force sure didn’t require you to be an E-5 to be married. Not in 1962 when my parents were married, and not in 1981 when I was married.
The upper ranks were always the ones who received base housing before the lower ranks, even though the lower ranks were the ones who could have used that housing with the electricity and water paid.
My parents were forced into housing in Alaska by the command. Someone with some common sense realized that the lower ranks could not afford to rent and pay the utilities on the economy.
I will agree that the smart thing to do would be to wait until reaching NCO before getting married and then wait a couple of years to have children, but in no way, shape or form, do I think we have the right to tell someone when to get married or have children. Just because you sign on the dotted line to defend our country it doesn’t make you a slave.
I don’t see it as a low opinion, lower enlisted are not long out of high school, most were not taught anything about finances by their parents; hard to believe but true.
It has nothing to do with their intelligence, it is a lack of instruction and experience.
The housing allowance for an E-3?
They are paid $23k a year. They are not getting $20k a year housing allowance.
Most of the base housing nowadays is run by the private sector and you pay rent.
My dad was career Navy, and I remember as a kid my mother would, on occasion, be extremely unhappy when we moved into family quarters on base. Angry, and tearful yelling, especially his last duty station. The house was small (for six kids) and in crappy shape.
But I give my mom credit, even if she was unhappy, she would eventually suck it up and make it a home. Buckets, brushes, bleach, soapy water, paint, and a sewing machine.
And when we moved out, my mother vowed to never leave an incoming family a pigsty. She enlisted all of us in the days before we moved out to scrub the entire place clean as a whistle.
And my dad was an officer. I can only imagine what some of the enlisted housing may have been like...not from the laziness of the former inhabitants, but more from the lack of attention by the Navy to keep the maintenance up on them.
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