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To: monkeyshine
I think we can safely say that real justice is a slow process. Whether there is a process in place now for spygate is anyone's guess. But ultimately there may need to be a blue ribbon investigation that exonerates many of the principals like Brennan ahd Comey. The next level down probably won't get much punishment either e.g. McCabe. Below that level they will say zey were just following zee orderz.

If you look at the big spygate diagram, a big problem is that the British can spy on American citizens and swap information with American agencies. In spygate there was specific foreign interference, mainly British and the one Aussie diplomat who was buddies with Bill Clinton. Not just spying but setups. They were of course working with American intel which will need reforming. Don't know yet how that will happen, maybe not even CWII (which our enenies want). I think a collapse and reset of the federal government might do it.

63 posted on 12/01/2018 6:26:40 PM PST by palmer (...if we do not have strong families and strong values, then we will be weak and we will not survive)
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To: palmer

For the Republic to survive the rule of law must be upheld. It has to be done, but imo it must be done using the tools we already have in place. If it takes 2 or 3 special councils or scores of regional prosecutors in order to give balance (not to mention safety in numbers, you could eliminate one and get away with it but you couldn’t eliminate three) so be it. What we can’t abide is any more delays. I suspect Trump knows it. He will not gain a second term if he continues to just play defense. He has to take his opposition down, and he has to force the media to turn around. They will be unable to ignore the story, loathe as they would be to report it, when high ranking people turn states evidence and grand jury indictments are unsealed. They are of course using all the misdirection they can muster right now but they get away with it because of the complete absence of any justice. They have given us all the dots but they can and will not connect them until it is done for them in the form of prosecutions.

The rumor mill is amok, no way to know or trust what it says. But some say Lynch is talking, some say Ohr or talking, some say Rosenstein has flipped, some say Whittaker is putting a muzzle on Mueller... so while you think some on the top will be exonerated I am not so sure. I am certain the conspiracy reaches the Obama Oval Office, the evidence shows that it does (Susan Rice’s email + Strzok’s texts about the White House running the show). But I am also sure Obama will escape as Presidents just don’t prosecute other Presidents and they have so many layers between them and the crimes that insulate them. People will fall on their swords.

One thing I try to wrap my head around are all those immunity agreements Comey handed out. Now if Comey is guilty of conspiracies, sedition, obstruction of justice and handed out immunity to his co-conspirators, those agreements should not be allowed to stand. It could be the most epic battle the country has seen since 1865. Much bigger than Watergate. But I can only speculate and comment. We’ll see if or how it all shakes out.


69 posted on 12/01/2018 6:54:40 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: palmer

To your other point, Congress does need to act. It amazes me how the left went from opposition to the Patriot Act and mass “no blood for oil” protests to defense of the spy ring and wholesale support for Obama’s interventions, drone strikes, regime change etc. The people who a decade ago sat around their dinner tables and cocktail parties lamenting an intrusive FBI under Hoover that sought to infiltrate political organizations and frame Dr. King now cheer Comey and give Brennan a paid gig to spout lies on cable news.

There is even greater irony that it seems. I can remove judgement from the question and state simply that it is a necessity for the Director of the CIA to be a masterful liar and expert at deception. Those are the required skills for the job. Accepting that, though, you could never put him on the air every day and accept what he says to be true. He has a duty to lie to protect state secrets, and he is a trained, experienced deceiver whatever the case may be. For CNN to have hired him to give commentary on Trump, whom he conspired against, or on any other matter is beyond absurd.

I opposed the Patriot Act. I go against the grain of many here on FR in that I support Assange’s right to publish. I recognize the crimes that Snowden committed warrant prosecution, but believe he acted in the best interests of the Republic in so doing. Congress has to reform the laws, we cannot ask foreign countries to violate the Constitution on our behalf, just like we cannot allow the NSA or CIA et al to obtain “voluntarily” all our communications because ATT is a private company in possession of them. It is perverse in many ways, a violation of our 4th and 5th Amendment rights and worse, ATT, Google, Amazon etc receive billions in government contracts - there is no way they would refuse a request for our information anyway.


71 posted on 12/01/2018 7:19:38 PM PST by monkeyshine
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