Posted on 06/16/2019 5:04:47 PM PDT by robowombat
How much travel to Iran for vacation? That was the gist for my initial remark, or question; do Russians really want their nation allying with Iran and China rather than Western nations. Where they're traveling is probably not the best indicator of what they prefer for their nation.
And I'm not buying it that every Russian is free to travel anywhere, anytime, virtually without their government's permission.
A free press and the right to criticize their government, and objective public opinion polls could tell us far more about what the citizens think. What Russians think of this Putin initiative is probably the most relevant current question. Do you think they'll be thrilled to be disconnected from the internet beyond Russia?
Putin Signs 'Russian Internet Law' To Disconnect Russia From The World Wide We
“” “” That still doesn’t indicate what the Russian people want for their nation now and in the future. They might be traveling less to the US because it is so expensive compared to a road or rail trip into one of the many nations that border Russia.”” “”
What road or rail trip? To Vietnam or Cuba or Dominican Republic? Are you kidding me? Ten years ago a tour to Florida was just marginally more expensive than a tour to Thailand from Russia. The latter is still popular.
What has changed are US consular policies limiting a number of visa hearings available per day and a number of offices accepting applications. That creates a situation when if you want a US visa you need to travel to another city and to be in a waiting list before that often for months.
That might be okay for a mail order bride or other sort of potential illegal immigrant who has nothing else to do but is not acceptable for a tourist or businessmen.
Imagine you are a family who wanted to see a Grand Canyon and Disneyland or a businessman who wanted to go to eye some industrial equipment for his factory? Would you ever agree to come through all the travesty?
The answer is simple. You would go to Disneyland to Paris, would see a canyon in China and would go to Germany to buy your presses and milling machines there. Even if it means to spend more.
“” “” How much travel to Iran for vacation? That was the gist for my initial remark, or question; do Russians really want their nation allying with Iran and China rather than Western nations. Where they’re traveling is probably not the best indicator of what they prefer for their nation.”” “”
The travel between Iran and Russia is visa-free so there are less bureaucratic obstacles but you are right that few people are travelling there. Obviously less than to US but mostly because Iran is not for everyone when it comes to business opportunities or sightseeing.
As for China you don’t have a realistic understanding on what modern China is but Russians has.
It has both tourist and business value. As for the latter it is a place they can get near everything they can’t get in the West anymore since it closed itself and at half or less the price. And they don’t need to move their production to China to get that. You already did it for them.
“”””And I’m not buying it that every Russian is free to travel anywhere, anytime, virtually without their government’s permission.””””
Article 27 of Russian Constitution says otherwise. You might very well believe the Earth is flat too but it would still be round anyway. As we found out objectively it is more like US has a de-facto iron curtain around which is of course a joke but the fact is Russians are using their rightto free travel at much higher rate.
” “” “A free press and the right to criticize their government, and objective public opinion polls could tell us far more about what the citizens think. What Russians think of this Putin initiative is probably the most relevant current question. Do you think they’ll be thrilled to be disconnected from the internet beyond Russia?
Putin Signs ‘Russian Internet Law’ To Disconnect Russia From The World Wide We “” “”
You have some twisted impression of sovereign internet bill. The point of it is not to have a local network disconnected from the outside world but to maintain internet inside the country functional in case if it would be disconnected by the beloved West.
As for a freedom of press it is really funny. Even the mainstream Russian media is more critical to the government than you could see in US during Obama years. And there are opposition media in Russia which has the only function of being critical to the government 24/7.
We should have dealt with Russia and China when we had that sliver of opportunity after WWII. It was not popular to be hawkish right after an exhausting world war but Communism should have been extinguished right then and there but America had and still has communist ass kissers and love totalitarianism.
Others don't share you happy opinions.
And I'm sure Putin would never take any steps to shut off the Russia people from the World Wide Web considering the respect he showed for Russia's laws of succession which would have sidelined him years ago.
And your obsession with Russians' travel as some great indicator of the happiness and contentment of the population as a whole is ridiculous. Russia is a relatively poor nation and few of her citizens are making these trips you keep raving about.
Russia is not the old USSR, but it is far from some model of freedom and individual rights, and we still have little reliable information of what the Russian citizens really think of the current realities of life there.
Others don't share you happy opinions.
And I'm sure Putin would never take any steps to shut off the Russia people from the World Wide Web considering the respect he showed for Russia's laws of succession which would have sidelined him years ago.
And your obsession with Russians' travel as some great indicator of the happiness and contentment of the population as a whole is ridiculous. Russia is a relatively poor nation and few of her citizens are making these trips you keep raving about.
Russia is not the old USSR, but it is far from some model of freedom and individual rights, and we still have little reliable information of what the Russian citizens really think of the current realities of life there.
I am not raving and obsessed with travel. It was you who brought the freedom of travel and I explained you the factual reality which differs from your impression. And that ‘few people travelling’ are by far the larger number as percent of total population comparing to travelling Americans. That is an irrefutable fact just as the fact that Russians don’t need any permission to go elsewhere.
I also explained you the meaning of that internet bill.
Its content is contrary to that you have told. Would Putin disconnect WWW or not is off-topic even if he wanted so which I doubt. Nothing at all in the bill indicates it is about to switch off the access to the Internet in Russia. The contrary is true. Maybe you need to read ilthe bill to start with.
The opposition media in Russia is a reality too.
Nobody says Russia is a model for freedom and individual rights and yes it is a relatively poor county. It would be ridiculous to claim otherwise.
It is still doesn’t look even near the way you imagine.
All things considered Freedom House is not exactly an objective source for anything. It is a proxy organization for the Department of State with its major function to demonize governments it doesn’t like.
They are one of the reasons why do you believe in all these things which are even factually untrue.
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