(LEAD) Recovered virus patients retest positive due to 'dead' virus fragments: experts

Yonhap News Agency ^ | 13:49 April 29, 2020

[fluorescence]

SEOUL, April 29 (Yonhap) -- South Korean health experts said Wednesday that recovered coronavirus patients may have tested positive again due to traces of virus fragments that have been inactivated.

As of Tuesday, a total of 277 people who recovered from COVID-19 have retested positive here, according to the Korea Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (KCDC).

The country's central clinical committee for emerging disease control said there was no live virus present in such cases, positively refuting theories like the virus being reactivated or reinfection.

They said that apparent reinfection cases came because fragments of the virus remained in their bodies and showed up in test kits.

The country currently uses a reverse transcription polymerase chain reaction (PCR) test for the COVID-19 virus that works by finding the virus's genetic information, or RNA, in a sample taken from a patient.

The experts said this PCR test is so sensitive that it can still pick up parts of the small amount of RNA from a cell even after the person has recovered from COVID-19.

"RNA fragments still can exist in a cell even if the virus is inactivated," they said in a press release. "It is more likely that those who tested positive again picked up virus RNA that has already been inactivated."

Oh Myoung-don, head of the committee, said the cases in which people retested positive were due to technical limits of the PCR tests.

The committee further said it is virtually impossible for the virus to be reactivated unless the COVID-19 virus causes chronic infections.

"The COVID-19 virus does not invade inside of the cell nucleus and combine with a patient's DNA," Oh said. "It means that the virus does not create chronic infections."

Oh further said the COVID-19 virus is different from diseases such as HIV and hepatitis B in which the virus stays dormant inside of a cell nucleus and later causes chronic infection.

Concerns have risen over chronic infections after several COVID-19 patients stayed in hospitals over two months before being cured.

The country reported nine more cases of the new coronavirus Wednesday, bringing the nation's total infections to 10,761, the KCDC said. It marked the 11th day in a row that the number of new infections stayed at 15 or below.

khj@yna.co.kr (END)

[dp0622]

This is going to be terrible news for people who think this is Fear Republic.

and those few who for some crazy reason are actually hoping for the end of the world.

People who know this is Free Republic will love the news.

[usconservative]

"RNA fragments still can exist in a cell even if the virus is inactivated," they said in a press release. "It is more likely that those who tested positive again picked up virus RNA that has already been inactivated."

So there's no such thing as the virus going "dormant" after a period of time and then "re-activating" as has been speculated.

This is excellent news.

[Buckeye McFrog]

So you immune system does it’s job and kills off the virus. There’s a shocker.

This is sort of like how surfaces aboard the cruise ship were testing positive weeks later. The tests were detecting the genetic residue of dead viruses. Typical for DNA viruses I assume.

[Fresh Wind]

Another panic balloon has been popped.

[Buckeye McFrog]

Spellcheck on this tablet changed 2 words for absolutely no reason whatsoever. Grrrrrrr!

[Buckeye McFrog]

It’s still a virus, even if monkeyed with in a ChiCom lab. It’s rational to believe it will behave like others that came before it.

If they had had monkeyed with a tiger it might produce a bigger, meaner, stronger tiger. But it would still be a tiger. It would still have stripes and fangs and feline claws, and behave in certain predictable ways. They could not turn it into a lobster or a hippopotamus.

Don’t buy the media hype that this is the Chuck Norris of viruses.

[Freee-dame]

Very good news from South Korea.

[Diogenesis]

Oh is he stupid.

viral fragments are dead but still work and can cause
coagulopathy, ARD, etc. etc.

and their origin means there is still working viral
genome.

Oh is he stupid.

[Wonder Warthog]

"....viral fragments are dead but still work and can cause coagulopathy, ARD, etc. etc."

Uh, no. "Viral fragments" don't replicate/increase/spread. This is about the limits of the test, not the virus.

Which is why an ANTIBODY test is needed, not a "Covid" test that only detects the presence of the virus (or parts of dead virii).

[reformedliberal]

...still working viral genome....

______________________________
Viruses hijack living cells in order to replicate. Fragments may persist, but do not cause contagion.

It’s the same on your countertop: fragments that are already degraded may still persist. Tests recognize them. They are not contagious.

They do not go dormant. They do not form spores. I don’t know for sure, but I wonder if encountering these inactive bits of RNA may cause the immune system to produce antigens?

[hawkaw]

This is great news!

[Diogenesis]

actually, as i posted the fragments can still work.

for example, non-structural protein 1 (nsp1) targets the
host by initiating destruction of host mRNA.
Thus, the host anti-viral responses are impaired
just by the fragments very presence.

that was one example.

[Diogenesis]

good point. but fragments may herald persisting virus.

and the fragments may cause pathology, themselves.

[BobL]

We didn’t think those claims by South Korea were real, similar to the doorknobs and mail delivery.

If you want to get Coronavirus, hang out with a vector for 20 minutes in a confined space with little or no air venting - or hang out with a vector whose sneezing and coughing non-stop.

If you don’t want to get the virus, don’t do the above.

[moovova]

Good news, right?

[Wuli]

A fragment of the protein/virus devoid of it’s envelope IS “dead” in terms of its ability to cause a viral infection. It is active - able to survive as a viral agent and be infectious - only as long as its envelope has not degraded. So, an infectious droplet is sneezed out of someone and lands on some surface. It will “die” eventually on that surface if nothing intervenes. But traces of it may be identifiable for some time afterward, if nothing intervenes. But they are inactive fragments, not “viral”, not infectious agents.

The same thing can happen with the human immune system breaking up member units of a virus. The immune system will destroy the virus in a human cell (literally deconstructing it and breaking it up) and it will also destroy the envelope of any unattached member units of the virus before they can enter a new cell. Non viral chemical/gene pieces of the virus can be left over, but still recognized by their chemical/gene structure. They are inert and no longer viral. Over time, that “garbage” is gradually cleaned out of the human system. It is that chemical/gene structure viral tests are looking for, but many tests don’t look for the whole structure, just known distinct elements of it. From that limited identification false positive test results can be made.

[bitt]

p

[null and void]

Inactive virus fragments. Isn't that what makes vaccines work?

Bring Out Your Dead

Post to me or FReep mail to be on/off the Bring Out Your Dead ping list.

The purpose of the “Bring Out Your Dead” ping list (formerly the “Ebola” ping list) is very early warning of emerging pandemics, as such it has a high false positive rate.

The false positive rate was 100%.

At some point we may well have a high mortality pandemic, and likely as not the “Bring Out Your Dead” threads will miss the beginning entirely.

*sigh* Such is life, and death...

If a quarantine saves just one child's or one old fart’s life, it's worth it.

[null and void]

Spellcheck on this tablet changed 2 words for absolutely no reason whatsoever. Grrrrrrr!

My friend Otto Kor Wrecked has quite the sense of humor...