Posted on 09/10/2020 6:34:51 AM PDT by NobleFree
As we've noted here before, big banks and big technology firms have been big users of H1B visas, which enabled them to hire-in global talent and that were temporarily banned by President Trump in June 2020. Despite protestations that the ban will lead to pay inflation for the "finite pool of super-smart folks" that have U.S. citizenship, the ban also has plenty of supporters. Key among them is Hal Salzman, a professor of planning and public policy at Rutgers University.
There's absolutely no reason why banks and tech firms should complain about the lack of H1B visa talent, Salzman tells us. "Annual hiring demand for top talent positions is probably, say, 5,000 new hires a year. Make it 10,000 if you like," says Salzman. He points out that the U.S. produces 1.9m bachelors graduates a year, plus hundreds of thousands of Masters graduates, plus PhDs: "It seems implausible they can't find that number among the 1.9m."
In a paper published last year*, Salzman pointed out that only a third of all U.S. STEM degree holders are actually employed in STEM jobs, suggesting the majority are under-employed and that the supply of U.S. STEM graduates more than meets the country's demand. The same paper pointed out that the supply of U.S. STEM students is highly elastic and increasing. "The U.S. education system has produced ample supplies of students to respond to STEM labor demand," said Salzman.
Why, then, do banks and tech firms like to hire-in developers, quants and data specialists from overseas? Salzman says it's all about labor arbitrage and that the U.S. government shouldn't be supporting this. "H1B is the government reaching its hand into the pockets of tech workers (those lucky enough to get a job) and handing out the money it grabs to the tech companies' executives and shareholders," he claims, echoing other supporters of the ban.
If banks and technology firms really need specialist talent from overseas following the H1B ban, Salzman says they can still hire it using things like the O-1 Visa for outstanding talent which has fewer constraints than the H1B. They could also recruit some of PhD students who leave U.S. universities each year, only half of whom Salzman says are in "career jobs."
"Are we to believe the talent these companies are looking for is so extraordinarily rare and greater than doctoral scientists? Or engineers?" says Salzman. "I'd like a cheaper iphone but, so far, the government hasn't created a program to lower the cost, say by using some of Apple's astronomical profit (on which they pay close to zero taxes via the double Dutch)," he adds.
*STEM Performance and Supply: Assessing the Evidence for Education Policy
In the year 2020 “H1B Visa talent” is an oxymoron.
I am on a conference call right now. Half the participants are from India. A couple are easy to understand. The rest might as well not be talking.
I’ve been in IT since 1983. Meetings were my strength. Now, I mostly just tune out. Either people are using conference phones, making them hard to understand, or they are these folks who speak very broken english.
This was driven home to me a week ago when we had a GREAT meeting. Every single person on the call was using an individual phone, and they were all US citizens that speak english as their first language. It didn’t hit me until the next day why that meeting was so awesome.
I’m done. I’ll be retiring next year, if not sooner. It’s nothing more than a simple source of income now. If they were to lay me off, that would be PERFECT.
I can not emphasize enough what this language crap does to both stress and productivity.
I worked for a large bank before I retired.
Yes, we did use H1Bs. But we also had large offices in India, full of Indian IT professionals who were bank employees. The pay and benefits were pretty good over there - they had nice cafeterias, a gym, and servants to deliver tea in the afternoon.
They were treated as regular employees. You could be a worker in the US reporting to a boss in India, who reported to some fellow in the UK, who reported to the big boss in the US who sat right next to you.
The time differences were a killer. It was hard to have a team meeting when we had 3 people in New Jersey, 5 in Ohio, 3 in Chicago, and 8 in Mumbai.
I completely agree with this assessment.
How about a REAL BAN on H1B, H2B, L1, and other visa workers, giving them 60 days to leave the country? And root out all of the former visa workers now working in HR jobs that lockout American workers? SEND THEM ALL HOME. The only good Indian is one heading to the airport to fly home.
How many of those 1.9m are just fine arts degrees? Or masters in 17th century french peotry?
i manage in IT and most of our US applicants dont have degrees. If any have it on their resume, it turns out they just took an intro course. That being said, they usually still have better critical thinking skills than the H1B counterparts.
We’re not talking about 5,000 or 10,000. The Big banks have their office buildings stuffed full of H1b Indians......20-25% of all the people in the building. All of them. Its not just tech jobs either. They have them in everything from higher level Systems Architect type roles all the way down to Data Analyst roles. They take what are otherwise standard finance/accounting roles, claim that because they use a little bit of technology they are “tech” roles and then proceed to hire cheap H1b Indians for those too. They were even doing this in the midst of the Great Recession when lots of qualified Americans were pounding the pavement looking for jobs.
There are plenty of Americans who could do these jobs or who could very quickly be trained to do a lot of these jobs. But because of cheap foreign labor, they don’t get their foot in the door at these big banks and thus can’t climb the corporate ladder. Slapping major restrictions on the H1b and similar programs would result in more young Americans getting hired and more experienced American middle manager types getting a 20-30% increase in their salaries.
Bingo!
I’m just really glad I still have an American boss. Of course, because I’m deeply in IT, we have tons of indians as well. Of course, anything that requires planning, thought, or actual integration is done by the Americans on the team. Rote work is handled by the otherwise useless folks overseas.
One thing that adds a lot of stress to our group is that pretty much the entire Change Management team is offshore, or otherwise not actual American folk. They do nothing but run through checklists, with no idea or care as to actual business requirements. Almost to a person they work against you, not with you to help get things done. It is very annoying and stressful.
A recent problem is the Indians have taken over almost all the job placement firms in America. It is like a virus. I have 20 years of IT experience. There is no way for me to find a job now. This has been a foreign invasion devised by our own government. There has been no violence, yet.
I have made a good living fixing code created by H1B ‘talent’.
You describe my company to a T. Once the Indians get in, they just keep hiring them and as they get into management, the flow increases.
Pretty soon, Americans need NOT apply!
Re: “He points out that the U.S. produces 1.9m bachelors graduates a year, plus hundreds of thousands of Masters graduates, plus PhDs: “It seems implausible they can’t find that number among the 1.9m.””
***
How many of those 1.9m are just fine arts degrees? Or masters in 17th century french peotry?
i manage in IT and most of our US applicants dont have degrees. If any have it on their resume, it turns out they just took an intro course. That being said, they usually still have better critical thinking skills than the H1B counterparts.””
***
You have just pointed out the fact that being good in IT requires an ability at critical thinking and logic. There’s no way a degree is needed for that.
Bemoaning a fictional lack of new grads with IT degrees is just a distraction from the real issue cheap labor.
Additionally no one mentions the proven, experienced Americans who are aged out of the field at ~35 by HR policies.
Curry code!
The banks don’t have a need for H1B visa talent. The banks do have a need for H1B cheap labor.
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