Posted on 03/07/2022 6:45:33 AM PST by Conservat1
But if Ukraine has been whipped as someone here claims, why does Russia need to negotiate anything?
Putin also wants a puppet Prime minister installed and Zelenksky would then become honorary president.
Putin is in panic because Russia defaults on its sovereign debt on March 16.
No to NATO, yes to EU (like Austria)
Recognition of Crimea's annexation, reintegration of Donbas "republics," preferably Ukraine but Russia if necessary as their continued existence is a constant source of provocation for both sides, like the Saarland was.
Ukraine's independence and neutrality to be guaranteed by both US and Russia (again like Austria)
No foreign troops except trainers in both Ukraine and Belarus.
Return to INF, Conventional Forces and OSCE treaties.
The Ukes gave up their nukes for a guarantee. Good luck on this deal.
Seems like a sensible outcome to me. I figured Putin was going for everything east of the Dnieper plus a guarantee of no NATO.
He's also dropped his demands for a demilitarized Ukraine.
It's a good deal. Putin will never cede Crimea. The Russian navy depends on it. And Donetsk and Luhansk don't want to be part of Ukraine anyways. Are they not allowed to pursue independence? We bombed Serbia so that Kosavo could achieve the very same thing that these two Oblasts are asking for. The real question is what do Ukrainians think about it?
I don't think it's going to happen though.
If you listened to his speech prior to this “war” He never said any of that. All of this hype was whipped up by the propaganda machine and arm chair generals with keyboards who decided they know what someone else says and does even though they don’t.
And now, things are much worse for all of us in the end no matter what happens. That said, this chaos is what some people needed at the expense of people they don’t care about. It is all sickening.
Our best hope is a Northern Ireland situation. It won’t be South Africa under apartheid.
Real Ukrainians will take Putin’s deal except for the installing a Russian puppet as Prime Minister part and making Zelensky an “honorary” President.
The same ones it got when it gave up its nuclear weapons? How did that turn out?
That’s very reasonable actually.
Russia had essentially achieved those goals prior to this massive debilitating invasion. Putin has made a catastrophic, disastrously bad decision. Russia has been weakened in every way and has shown the world that its military is not the juggernaut people once feared.
Putin has lost the real political support of the Russian people, morale is low and resentment is rampant throughout all ranks of the military and Russia is becoming impoverished.
If the Ukrainian negotiators countered that Putin must be deposed before there is peace, that condition would not be a non starter.
The real question is what do Ukrainians think about it?
My guess this is their “come and take it” moment
Crimea is already controlled Russia, and the eastern regions are a headache. Neutrality was one of the issues that started the war.
Also, notice how our propaganda masters are using “Kremlin” instead of “Russia”.
Zelinsky should counter with, you can have my answer now, Mr Putin. We’ll keep all of Ukraine, including Crimea, and we will be joining the EU and NATO and any other bloc we wish. You can keep your puppet. Oh, and you will pay our membership fees.
I can’t imagine that Putin ever wanted all of Ukraine. It would be too difficult to control. So that list is probably everything that Putin wanted in the first place.
Ask for the moon, then “reluctantly” accept your original demands.
Anyway, it’s up to Ukraine to accept or reject the deal. But if it’s accepted, I sure hope it’s not back to business as usual in the West with regards to Russia.
Just like media won hearts and minds for Covid and vaccines? Those same guys? The same ones ignoring the now released 9 pages of side effects? We can trust them. Prior to this war nobody knew where Ukraine was, now they’re all for them! So inspiring!
Who are you talking about, Putin, Zelinsky, the Clinton-Biden crime cartel? Who?
What happened to that 1997 treaty in which Russia agreed that Crimea is part of Ukraine? I guess it was nullified by the discovery of Black Sea oil and gas offshore of Crimea in 2012.
Left unsaid is the status of what’s been taken, the nuclear reactors come to mind. Putin may be looking to avoid the meat grinder that will be the leveling of Ukraine, which looks like that’ the only way he can take it. Talking out of my hat here. Just want it to be over.
“What good is a World without Russia?” he said.
Charlie Manson with nukes. Helter Skelter, 2022.
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