Posted on 10/21/2008 8:24:15 AM PDT by Antioch
don't understand how someone can seriously say this about themselves: "I was raised as a Catholic, I'm a practicing Catholic, and I'm totally at home with the Catholicism that I was raised in and this whole culture of social responsibility, reaction to abuse of power, the whole notion that there is collective civic responsibility. It's the Catholic consciousness that I'm totally comfortable with."
... only to spew this nonsense: "It is not choice. It's always a very, very, very difficult, difficult decision. I know that, my church has wrestled with this for 2,000 years.
We've always believed from the outset that abortion is wrong. But throughout the years, debated the degree to which it is wrong. There are always cases where it is never a first choice. It is always viewed as a dire decision. But throughout the church's history, we've argued between whether or not it is wrong in every circumstance and the degree of wrong. Catholics have this notion, it's almost a gradation.
We have mortal sins, venial sins, well, up until Pius IX, there were times when we said, 'Look, there are circumstances in which it's wrong but it is not damnation. Along came Pius IX in the 1860s and declared in fine doctrine, this was the first time that it occurred that it was absolute human life and being at the moment of conception. It's always been a debate."
And then conclude by saying: "I take my religion very seriously." (... just obviously not enough to study it.)
Oh well, I guess I'm just no Joe Biden.
Another jem: "I'm a John XXIII guy, I'm not a Pope John Paul guy." At least that puts him ahead of John Kerry, who claimed he was a "Pope Pius XXIII" kind of guy.
Did he claim the Catholic Church has wrestled with the issue of abortion for 2,000 years?
“But throughout the church’s history, we’ve argued between whether or not it is wrong in every circumstance and the degree of wrong. Catholics have this notion, it’s almost a gradation.”
That is an outright LIE! (...or is it possible that he THAT ignorant of Church Teaching on this topic?)
Hey Plugs, who the he** are you listening to that you got such an historical perspective? Cardinal Pelosi? The Catholic Church has been clear on this throughout it's existence: Abortion is Murder of a Child. No hems or haws or 'except fors". No bebating to what degree it's wrong... none.
Uh, I don’t remember John XXIII endorsing abortion.
This guy does Saturday Night Live in real-time......
Pure unadulterated bullpucky. The Catholic Church has never waivered on the sanctity of human life and the advent of the soul. He's a CINO and maybe not even that!
2004 Interview: Obama Talks about Jesus, Heaven and Sin
June 3, 2008
With Barack Obama about to head into the general election, he’ll need to re-introduce himself to the American people. Many folks just don’t know that much about him. One thing we do know is that Obama is a Christian, not a Muslim. He talks about his Christian faith quite a bit but because of some of his liberal positions (read: abortion, civil unions) he’s going to need to really work hard to convince religious moderates and religious conservatives that they have common ground.
In 2004, he gave an interview to Cathleen Falsani who was the religion reporter at the Chicago Sun-Times. I must say the whole interview is remarkable. Below are some parts of it where Obama talks about Jesus, heaven and sin. The whole interview can be read here.
(GG is God Girl aka Cathleen Falsani)
GG: Who’s Jesus to you?
OBAMA: Right. Jesus is a historical figure for me, and he’s also a bridge between God and man, in the Christian faith, and one that I think is powerful precisely because he serves as that means of us reaching something higher. And he’s also a wonderful teacher. I think it’s important for all of us, of whatever faith, to have teachers in the flesh and also teachers in history.
It is slander to claim that Pope John XXIII did not believe and teach the same Catholic Faith as every Pope who has followed him.
Joe Biden is ... well, I don’t want to get a moderator after me, so I’ll just stop there. Socially-acceptable words fail me.
I didn’t know you could pick your pope.
More nonsense from Bidden.
Joe Biden - the gift that keeps on giving......
I’m a John XXIII guy is code for
“I am not a Catholic anymore.”
I have been hearing this all my life. My Uncle who never went to church and hated the church but remained a nominal Catholic used to say the same thing. John XXIII is code for no accountability and the lame, ‘the church hasn’t been the same since they got rid of the Latin Mass crud’. John Paul is code for moral and theological accountability. Biden wants none of that...just like he wants to claim he’s from Scranton while he sucks down Shrimp Cocktail in the club car.
What a jerk!
I think Plugs may have meant: “...My parish has been wrestling with this for 40 years...”
Is that a rejection of the divinity of Christ, or is this whole Christianity thing too new to Barry to know?
I very much doubt Blessed John XXIII would be pro-abortion or pro-same sex marriage.
I am not a John XXIII guy or a John Paul guy. I don't even follow a plumber, although I understand him completely and admire him. My guy is a carpenter, and one of his biggest fans wrote:
1 Corinthians 1:12b-13
... that each one of you says, "I follow Paul," "I follow
Apollos," "I follow Cephas," and, "I follow Christ." Is
Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you
baptized into the name of Paul?
From a standpoint of public policy, who cares what some religious organization has said about it? The question of when a living human comes into being has been conclusively settled by biology and medical science for decades now.
Well the bishop of Wilmington did a good job of responding to Plugs the last time he dared hold forth on Catholic doctrine.
Lets see if it does it again.
Once again, old Joe shows his lack of knowledge on yet another subject. For the self-described “most intelligent member of the Senate”, what he knows would fit in a thimble and leave room enough for an elephant.
His VERY expensive prep school bills itself as a Catholic school. One wonders if “Champ” - his nickname in school - skipped all his religion classes OR the priests felt so sorry for him that they passed him anyway.
Since, by his definition, Catholics can pick and choose popes; I’ll go with Pope St. Pius X - who condemned all the Modernist errors) and Pope Pius XII (who did more than we’ll ever know).
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