And likewise. After a shaky start way back when, we have actually had meaningful dialogue and conversation.
I am not concerned in the least - ever - as I think you know, with Protestant thought, with what Luther wrote or thought, etc. It is all interesting to academics. It may inform us historically. It doesn’t bind us.
However, it does illustrate the change in Protestant thought as opposed to traditional Christian thought. The issue of 'saints' was unopposed until people began to think that they personally were able to interpret the Bible and create their own theology. Up until that time, the Church went on St Paul's instruction that the Church was the pillar and foundation of truth, not each man.
He clearly calls all Christians saints. Since we do not believe in spiritual death for believers, their whereabouts are immaterial (had to say it). All remain what God spoke... here or there.
You wouldn't have Scripture that says specifically that, do you?
If it depends on our works to define sainthood, no one would be a saint. If it depends on the righteousness of Christ, imputed to us by His grace, we rest in Him, give Him all the credit and glorify Him forever.
If we depended on our works to save us, nobody would be saved. Yet, by the blood of Christ and the promise of salvation, we are made heirs. Yet, we can, and many do, reject that inheritance. Christ came to save all men, yet, does a Mao Tse Tung or a Charles Manson get to be saved? I don't know. I am not the Judge, but going by the words that He has left us, and the teachings of the Church, probably not.
Hope today is a great day for you and your family. Sun is shining here and Spring is apparently going to make a long-awaited appearance.
Better here today. The kids' soccer games were at least bearable. I was going to write to Algore and ask him for a cup of Global Warming.
I’ve always found you to be sincere and a true FRiend here. In real life, I know I’d enjoy having a beer and cooking out burgers with you and your family. :-) You love Christ and think and I appreciate our friendship on FR, even though we disagree on things outside the Creeds. We do agree on virtually everything that is core. Our differences make our conversation enjoyable.
... A couple notes of feedback.
“The issue of ‘saints’ was unopposed until people began to think that they personally were able to interpret the Bible and create their own theology. Up until that time, the Church went on St Paul’s instruction that the Church was the pillar and foundation of truth, not each man.”
... The blessing of the Reformation is that salvation by faith in the Gospel of Grace was restored. It is too much to think all other theological issues would be resolved at the same time. The following centuries allowed a reexamination of the complete record of Holy Scripture in a systematic way. Obviously, the rise in literacy and movable type helped spread a love of God’s Word. Amazingly, this is still happening. I have friends with Wycliffe who continue to translate His Word into several tribal languages in a muslim country. Many have already come to trust and know Christ.
... The Church is described as the pillar and foundation of faith - as it should always be. We only disagree on what that statement means when it uses the word, “church”. :-)
... Everyone should stive to examine and understand the Word of God, as the command reads - “to show ourselves approved as workmen, rightly dividing the Word of Truth.” I fail to see how someone can love God with his or her “whole mind”, if they refuse to engage God’s Word with sincere thought, effort and desire.
... Let’s also be frank here as believers. There are LOTS of “Christians” of every denomination that “make up there own theology” anyway - using whichever bits and pieces of Scripture that appeal to them - and this despite teaching authorities. Let’s go farther. Even inside the Church, historically, leaders did the same.
... In addition, Paul and Peter right that God gave teachers to the Church. That doesn’t provide any believer with cover to not know God’s Word. It does keep the Church on track theologically.
“He clearly calls all Christians saints. Since we do not believe in spiritual death for believers, their whereabouts are immaterial (had to say it). All remain what God spoke... here or there.
“You wouldn’t have Scripture that says specifically that, do you?”
... which part? The calling of Christians saints, or the part about no Christian being dead? Or some other thought...?
” Christ came to save all men, yet, does a Mao Tse Tung or a Charles Manson get to be saved? I don’t know. I am not the Judge, but going by the words that He has left us, and the teachings of the Church, probably not. “
... It seems doubtful, but it certainly would involve them turning from their sin to Him before their death. I don’t know of any historical passage that says this happened. He knows. Still, His blood covers the sins of men who entrust themselves to Him.
We’re finally having a Great Day of Global Warming here - nice enough to have our first cook out! I still hope to snag some great beachfront property when the Oceans rise enough to create a new shoreline.