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To: HarleyD

That makes sense, since “all scripture is useful for... instruction.” If the saga of the Israelites meant nothing to modern Christians then this would not be true. Now some segments of Christendom (and I count myself among them) hold with a view that actually says the literal Jews are coming back into the limelight. Some call it dispensationalism. I don’t necessarily buy into everything that proponents of that view have propounded, but it answers a lot of questions including the question of how could God be woofing to those Israelites and only meaning figurative, spiritualized-out promises and not further literal ones like the literal promises they knew for thousands of years?


179 posted on 05/19/2013 4:32:15 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

There are verses which specifically speak to that subject.


183 posted on 05/19/2013 4:40:12 PM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
If the saga of the Israelites meant nothing to modern Christians then this would not be true.

Not only was Israel the maintainer of the law, but they were give to us as an example and warning.

As far as the Jews, only those who believe in and obey the Son are saved:

This would include any "Jew". And if a Jew becomes a believer in Christ, then isn't he a Christian?
190 posted on 05/19/2013 4:54:14 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HiTech RedNeck
That makes sense, since “all scripture is useful for... instruction.” If the saga of the Israelites meant nothing to modern Christians then this would not be true. Now some segments of Christendom (and I count myself among them) hold with a view that actually says the literal Jews are coming back into the limelight. Some call it dispensationalism. I don’t necessarily buy into everything that proponents of that view have propounded, but it answers a lot of questions including the question of how could God be woofing to those Israelites and only meaning figurative, spiritualized-out promises and not further literal ones like the literal promises they knew for thousands of years?

Of course what used to called (by folks knowledgeable about the Bible back in the day) the "whole counsel of God" must be - as always - kept in mind; with that said, Romans 11 addresses the topic of Jews' belief in Christ and the relationship all Christians have with them in this regard. I very, very much recommend starting at Romans 10 to get some context.

Matthew Henry's commentary on the chapters is helpful; it's available on biblegateway.com, while more succint notes are in the Reformation Study Bible notes on that same website. Just click on the 'Show resources' link at the top right of the text.

I very, very much recommend studying those chapters on this subject, as part of a general pursuit of the whole of Scripture, as they set forth a great deal of doctrine quite clearly.

Notes to "unbelievers" coming across this:

Having been discussed within the Church for many years prior to the closing of the Canon, the doctrine revealed within Paul's Epistle to the Romans carries great weight as testimony of God's Word. This is due to its standing the test of discussion and debate at a time when the older generation within the Church was alive at the time of Christ. Accordingly, they would be very knowledgable of the Old Testament, since per the custom of the day there was a great deal of memorization and study of it, as well they would be very aware of Jesus' words and deeds during his earthly ministry. The text of Romans agreement with the understanding of Old Testament and Jesus' teachings that the early Church members and elders had is evidenced by the inclusion of Romans in the Canon.

Also, the Apostle Paul was, prior to his conversion, a Jew who was part of the hierarchy that persecuted Christians. His story is wonderful. If you can't get up the gumption to read the Bible, I'd recommend the 1981 moved "Peter and Paul" that was posted here today, I think, by ReformationFan, has Anthony Hopkins in it as Paul.
242 posted on 05/19/2013 6:52:48 PM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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