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Where the Christian Right Is Strong (national map included)
The New York Times ^ | July 2, 2014

Posted on 07/02/2014 5:05:48 PM PDT by Faith Presses On

The religious right remains one of the most potent forces in American politics, but Northeasterners could be forgiven for forgetting. Evangelical Christians and Mormons, the two religious groups who most consistently espouse conservative political and cultural views, are basically absent in the Northeastern corridor.

The map shows the number of regular Evangelical Christian or Mormon congregation members, as reported by religious bodies. The data, therefore, does not include every Mormon or Evangelical Christian in the country. Black Protestant denominations are a separate category from other Evangelical Protestant denominations in this data set, and are not represented on this map.

The map does not neatly represent the religious right, either. There are many religious and cultural conservatives who do not regularly attend church, perhaps especially in West Virginia, where reported attendance is unusually low.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Current Events; General Discusssion; Moral Issues; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: christendom; christianity; christianright; christianstates; statesmap
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To: fso301

“I think it safer to say Mormons are not mainstream Christians. Belief in the Trinity is not a condition for salvation and scriptural support for the Trinity is not as strong as many assume it to be.”

1. Mormonism perverts the Gospel and the nature of God - making Him into a creature instead of eternal. It teaches the existence of an unlimited number of gods, with more being created every day and on a multitude of planets.

2. Your post indicates a lack of understanding of the Scriptures in regard to the nature of God.

3. Every cult in addition to the Mormon cult perverts the same issues.


81 posted on 07/04/2014 6:25:54 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Maximus)
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To: fso301
That is correct.

My Witness for Christ

God's speed and blessings to you and yours.

82 posted on 07/04/2014 6:34:12 AM PDT by Jeff Head
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To: Linda Frances
Does it concern anyone when the left, whose number one enemy is Christians, is mapping out where we live?

My thoughts also. But the NT church grew in an even more antagonistic yet more fertile perhaps, culture .

83 posted on 07/04/2014 6:37:13 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: Elsie

Its not as if all this was hidden.


84 posted on 07/04/2014 6:41:06 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: Elsie

But can you document this?:)


85 posted on 07/04/2014 6:43:08 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans; daniel1212; Elsie
Mormons are polytheists who also believe that they themselves will become gods after death, provided they are holy enough, which is clearly condemned throughout the entirety of the scripture, such as when God declares "Is there a God beside me? Nay, there is no God; I know not any" (Isa 44:8). There is no "gray" area between the historical belief in one God by Jews and Christians for more than two thousand years and the Mormon belief in many gods. Furthermore, to hold to a false Gospel is damning. The Apostle teaches that whoever preaches a different Gospel than what he has delivered to us, "let him be accursed" (Gal 1:8). Similarly, the Apostles also condemn those who wish 'God speed' to those who teach false gospels, so that even those who apologize for the enemies of Christ, though they themselves may claim to not be of them, also share in the guilt (2 John 1:10-11).

Thank you but I'll defer direct response to your first paragraph simply in order to maintain focus of the topic at hand which is the Trinity. In another thread when I have more time I'd be happy to broaden the discussion.

The Trinity is also not obscure, but a clear and present reality in the scripture.

Please cite the verse that you believe makes it so clear.

Nor do Christians tolerate those who refuse to affirm the Trinity and who give succor to those who deny it, although they themselves pretend to be "moderate" Christians. There is no option for being neither hot nor cold when it comes to the essentials of the Christian faith, but instead an active confession is required (Rom 10:9, Rev 3:15-16). If you hold yourself in a position where you neither affirm or deny such an important question as whether the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are a trinity, then you are damned,

Please show me the scripture which says that. In your first paragraph you strongly condemned anyone spreading a false gospel so, show me the scripture that places salvation subject to belief in the Trinity. If your bible contains such scripture in it's gospel message, please include the type bible and translation.

86 posted on 07/04/2014 8:08:29 AM PDT by fso301
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To: Elsie
It's good to avoid assumptions as much as possible; when we have ACTUAL evidence from MORMONism that can speak for itself; OK?

Thanks. That may be the most Mormon literature I have ever read. Without reading the entire book of mormon, or at least the chapter from which that page was extracted, I'd be reluctant to comment.

87 posted on 07/04/2014 8:15:03 AM PDT by fso301
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To: Elsie
There are a LOT more things that are 'required' by certain religions that are NOT biblical.

Very true.

Shall we enumerate them here; or continue to point out the FALSITY of Mormonism; compared to ANY Christian (traditional) group?

Please no. I can't type fast enough.

88 posted on 07/04/2014 8:38:09 AM PDT by fso301
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To: Elsie
Wish all you 'wish'; but one side thinks it is superior to the other, and has the ONLY way to gain salvation.

Such is the nature of belief.

89 posted on 07/04/2014 8:44:55 AM PDT by fso301
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
Your post indicates a lack of understanding of the Scriptures in regard to the nature of God.

Show me the scripture that defines the Trinity. Then show me the scripture that places salvation as being dependent upon belief in the Trinity.

90 posted on 07/04/2014 8:53:19 AM PDT by fso301
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To: fso301

The nature of God is defined by the totality of His revelation and not a single verse. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit all are revealed to have all the attributes of God. God is revealed as one God.

To believe in a multitude of gods - like Mormonism or Hinduism is not remotely Christian.


91 posted on 07/04/2014 9:10:44 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Maximus)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
The nature of God is defined by the totality of His revelation and not a single verse. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit all are revealed to have all the attributes of God. God is revealed as one God.

I think biblical evidence of divinity would be prayer and worship. Scriptures indicate the apostles prayed and worshiped both God the Father and Christ the Son. However, I know of no such scripture concerning the Holy Spirit.

Never-the-less, having established in scripture that God and Christ were divine, reconciling monotheism with God and Christ was necessary.

I believe there is a sufficient body of scripture to establish that the apostles understood God and Christ to somehow be one in the same and that there was no conflict with monotheism. However, I don't find where they had a clear understanding of the nature of the Holy Spirit. Was the Holy Spirit a diety, or some sort of force/presence? New Testament writers are not clear on that.

92 posted on 07/04/2014 9:32:59 AM PDT by fso301
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To: IrishBrigade; Linda Frances
...repenting from sin and turning against it doesn’t count as a ‘work’...? Do you contend that ‘grace’ is achieved through some involuntary osmotic process, independent of rational choice and subsequent action on that choice...? ...seems to me that ‘action’ and ‘work’ are one and the same...

When considering faith and works, works without faith is meaningless in the context of salvation. However, with faith will come works/fruits. New Testament authors recognized false conversions were occurring and in Gal 5:23 established a test of the Holy Spirit's indwelling in a person.

Gal 5:22-23 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
Naturally, the Gal 5:22-23 test is time based and will be different for each person depending on where they began their particular spiritual walk at.
93 posted on 07/04/2014 10:04:18 AM PDT by fso301
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To: fso301
If a person's interpretation of scripture causes them to reject the Trinity, that doesn't mean they aren't saved.

One can be confused, but for one, i do not believe one can be saved who denies the deity of Christ, which one implicitly does in trusting Him to give them eternal life, as that is one of many uniquely Divine attributes Christ possesses, as having the same nature, though there is an order in the Godhead.

See The DEITY of CHRIST by God's grace.

Thus to deny the Divine nature of Christ is to blaspheme God, as that would be ascribing uniquely Divine attributes to a created being, which is what the Jewish leaders saw the Lord Jesus as doing. And would have been right if He was not God manifest in the flesh.

Likewise the Spirit is obviously Divine, while that He is a person is sufficiently clear.

Thus while the doctrine of the Trinity was not formally defined till latter, it was essentially taught and believed before and thus it is Scripturally substantiated, which is why the same evangelicals who contend against Cath. traditions of men also contend for basic doctrine of the Trinity, .

94 posted on 07/04/2014 12:27:51 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: fso301
Please cite the verse that you believe makes it so clear.

Please cite the verse that you believe makes it clear that one verse is what makes a doctrine to be a clear and present reality in the scripture.

95 posted on 07/04/2014 12:29:15 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: fso301

“New Testament writers are not clear on that.”

To believe that reveals a lack of familiarity those writers.


96 posted on 07/04/2014 12:29:53 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Maximus)
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To: daniel1212

Thank you for all the research you do and bringing it to these threads. It’s very revealing. God bless you in your efforts.


97 posted on 07/04/2014 12:44:59 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
To believe that reveals a lack of familiarity those writers.

In what way? Where do those writers establish the divinity of the Holy Spirit?

98 posted on 07/04/2014 1:05:56 PM PDT by fso301
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To: fso301


In what way? Where do those writers establish the divinity of the Holy Spirit?”

To not know this most basic revelation shows a limited exposure to the New Testament.


99 posted on 07/04/2014 1:11:08 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Maximus)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
To not know this most basic revelation shows a limited exposure to the New Testament.

Then do me a favor and show me where the divinity of the Holy Spirit was clear to the New Testament writers.

100 posted on 07/04/2014 1:20:23 PM PDT by fso301
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