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To: unlearner; HarleyD; MHGinTN

I submit the purity of the Gospels, the perfection of the spoken Christ, do not require the chapter of Revelations. It is a book that scaremongers and greedy pulpiteers alike utilize to fill their pockets with something that cannot be known. I submit, Mark 14:30-33 alone is worth all the hobgobliny of Revelations.


71 posted on 04/10/2018 2:00:03 PM PDT by Bookshelf
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To: Bookshelf
Offered like one who has not a clue to the vagaries of what is in The Revelation of John. IF that revelation is not from God, it would not stand the test of scholarship in the Scriptures, Old and New Testament. IF, on the other hand, it IS from God, it belongs right where it is and is there by God's timing not the maneuvering of men and institutions like Catholicism.

Sorry, The Revelation will not be acceptable as your escape clause when you stand for judgment.

72 posted on 04/10/2018 2:20:40 PM PDT by MHGinTN (A dispensational perspective is a powerful tool for discernment)
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To: Bookshelf; HarleyD; MHGinTN

“Revelations... is a book that scaremongers and greedy pulpiteers alike utilize to fill their pockets with something that cannot be known. I submit, Mark 14:30-33 alone is worth all the hobgobliny of Revelations.”

There is a difference between someone who doubts the veracity of a text and someone who attacks and maligns it with vile insults.

The way a person knows he or she are a true believer in Christ is through the indwelling Holy Spirit who confirms this to us:

Romans 8:16
The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God.

2 Corinthians 13:5
Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.

Romans 8:9
But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

The revelation of Christ to any person can only come by the work of the Holy Spirit:

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 16:17-18
Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.”

The Holy Spirit leads those who have Him in their life to know the truth:

John 16:13
However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.

There are many witnesses confirming that the book of Revelation is the word of God and Spirit-inspired. Early church fathers identified John the apostle as the author. This comes from those who learned from Polycarp who was appointed bishop of Smyrna by John himself (and this is one of the seven churches to which the book was originally addressed).

Revelation is consistent with the entire Bible in terms of doctrine and prophetic imagery. It ties together the entire Bible and bookends it with the finality of the closing message:

Revelation 22:18-21
For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming quickly.”
Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus!
The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

This carries with it the same authoritative finality with which the Hebrew scriptures concluded:

Malachi 4:5-6
Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet
Before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord.
And he will turn
The hearts of the fathers to the children,
And the hearts of the children to their fathers,
Lest I come and strike the earth with a curse.

Revelation is confirmed by the Holy Spirit to be the word of God to those who have the Holy Spirit indwelling them.

Luke 24:32
And they said to one another, “Did not our heart burn within us while He talked with us on the road, and while He opened the Scriptures to us?”

Because of Christ living in me through the gift of the Holy Spirit, I am deeply grieved when I sin, I long to know more of Christ and His word, and I recognize His voice. This is one way I know that Revelation is the word of God.

John 10:26-27
But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

And by this same token I know you are not Spirit-led in this matter because you not only do not recognize the word of God, you attacked and maligned it. And the peril you are putting yourself in by doing so is incalculable.

John 5:39
You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me.

The book of Revelation is a revealing of Christ, just as all scripture is. And it is writing that was divinely inspired, being written as the author was moved to write by the Holy Spirit, just as all scripture is.

Revelation 2:7
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 2:11
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 2:17
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 2:29
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 3:6
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 3:13
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 3:22
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Revelation 14:13
Then I heard a voice from heaven saying to me, “Write: ‘Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.’”
“Yes,” says the Spirit, “that they may rest from their labors, and their works follow them.”

Revelation 22:17
And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

Some important warnings concerning the Holy Spirit:

1 Corinthians 2:12
Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

Ephesians 4:30
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

1 Thessalonians 5:19
Do not quench the Spirit.

Genesis 6:3a
And the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever.”

Matthew 12:24, 26, 28, 32
Now when the Pharisees heard [people asking if Jesus was the son of David] they said, “This fellow does not cast out demons except by Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons.”
[Jesus said,] If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand?... If I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you.
Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

Jude 19
These are sensual persons, who cause divisions, not having the Spirit.

We are to receive the Spirit, not grieve Him, not quench His work, not strive against Him, and certainly not blaspheme Him.

The ultimate answer to the question of the canonicity of Revelation is answered by the Holy Spirit Himself.


77 posted on 04/10/2018 5:19:46 PM PDT by unlearner (A war is coming.)
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To: Bookshelf; unlearner; MHGinTN

Today many of the Jew have a very difficult time interpreting Isaiah. There are parts of it, such as the suffering servant, that they completely ignore because they can’t understand it. Yet Isaiah is the pivotal book which bridges the Old and New Testament and the calling of the Gentiles into the Kingdom.

I would suggest a lack of understanding of Revelation does not mean it is any less inspired. And, I might add, I have yet to have someone explain it to me so that it makes sense. I don’t think anyone really knows until Christ returns.


84 posted on 04/11/2018 9:07:21 AM PDT by HarleyD ("There are very few shades of grey."-Dr. Eckleburg)
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