Caribbean cruise ship gives in to nicotine cravings

Detroit Free press ^ | 2/1/04 | Associated Press

[qam1]

NEW YORK -- Carnival is ending its smoke-free cruises aboard the Paradise.

The 2,052-passenger ship has operated since its introduction in 1998 as a smoke-free vessel, cruising from Miami to the Caribbean with a zero tolerance for cigars and cigarettes among both passengers and crew.

[Great Dane]

Are you saying that smokers make up 25% of the 'cruise customers'? I've never been on one, but that figure sounds pretty high to me. I'm curious what percentage of the population smokes. From the statistics I ha

Where have you been, 25% is the smoking population, and smokers takes cruises as much as the non-smokers, the proof is in the pudding, non-smoking cruises doesn't work.

[Great Dane]

Cruises aren't typically a cheap thing. The economy was probably more of a factor than anything else.

Economy my foot, the cruise business is booming.

[tiki]

Besides, I smoke but my husband doesn't, if I can't go neither will he. So I think that shrinks the base by another 10%.

[Uncle Sausage]

We're going to need another Timmy!

[Great Dane]

when I can book an odor free ship for the same money?

But thats the thing, I don't think you can anymore, all the other lines gave the non-smoking idea up years ago.

[Johnny_Cipher]

The nico-gnatzis are going to need another scapegoat. How about we start a nasty rumor that liberalism causes people to smoke?

[lockjaw02]

"Are you saying that smokers make up 25% of the 'cruise customers'? I've never been on one, but that figure sounds pretty high to me."

Smokers now make up approximately 20% of the population. But you have to think of the customer base. That is 20% of the entire population, to include children and infants. If you only consider the fare-paying adult public, then the percentage of potential customers they are alienating is much higher. And then you have to consider they alienate even more than that. Note that they said they had trouble booking groups. Many smokers have non-smoking friends and family members. When families and friends go on vacations together, do you think they'd pick a non-smoking cruise which is sure to alienate a percentage of the group over all the other alternatives? Personally, I'd love to see them turn much smaller ships that they can fill into 100% smoke-free cruises. That way folks like you can have your fun hobnobbing with those with like minds and the rest of us can enjoy our vacations without hearing the grousing.

[qam1]

Are you saying that smokers make up 25% of the 'cruise customers'? I've never been on one, but that figure sounds pretty high to me

1) Most of the people who go on cruises are probably more younger and younger people smoke at a higher %

2) Who says only US citizens ae going on these Cruises, You have a lot of Europeans and Asians going to(Someone from Germany or Japan is going to take a Carribiean cruise from America not all the way from Germany or Japan) and they smoke at a much higher % than Americans

[Just another Joe]

Your husband would be one of that 75% they better hope care enough about it to book a non-smoking cruise.

[Johnny_Cipher]

Personally, I'd love to see them turn much smaller ships that they can fill into 100% smoke-free cruises.

I also prefer a market-based solution like that. I've got no problem with non-smoking restaurants and private establishments either. Problem is that they seem to fail at a higher rate than others that permit tobacco use. Another example of a situation where government needs to keep its Mrs. Grundy-like beak out of the way and let the free market decide.

[Tunehead54]

I smoke - my wife quit long ago. Still there's no way I'm going even three days on a non-smoker. So the 25% figure when you allow for a potential "family" cruise may go up closer to 80% or better of smokers in the family that nix the idea due to the anti-smoking conditions. Seems reality has caught up with them. ;-)

[squidly]

You don't have to be particularly well off to be able to afford a cruise nowadays, particularly on Carnival, which is one of the cheapest lines, maybe the cheapest of the big ones.

[SheLion]

"We've never understood why it was not successful . . . We should've been sailing full," Carnival spokesman Tim Gallagher told the Miami Herald.

Yea, right!

I just wish the airlines would see the err of THEIR ways and bring back the smoking sections.

[SheLion]

Wasn't there a non-smoking casino in LV that went belly up?

Yes, there sure was!

[lockjaw02]

There is a market for smoke-free places and many have already filled that niche in many places. Heck, there are 177 smoke-free restaurants listed on the smokefreedc.org site (not included fast food places), but that ain't enough. They lost a bid for pushing a ban through in December, so now they're calling for a public referendum to institute an all-inclusive ban. The anti-smokers want em all. Intolerance is never satisfied.

If only common sense prevailed a little more often.

[lockjaw02]

Are you sure? I thought it tested the market, but turned back to smoking when the throngs of anti-smokers never materialized.

[Hodar]

That way folks like you can have your fun hobnobbing with those with like minds and the rest of us can enjoy our vacations without hearing the grousing.

Exactly. I don't care if you smoke, I just don't want to smell it. I think a lot of non-smokers feel the same way, however there are the 'crusaders' who feel that forcing their will upon others somehow makes them better. Personally, I think those type of people are (deleted, as the moderator would quash this post).Percentage of U.S. adults who smoke.

Incidentally, I was surprised at the percentage of smokers in the US. Here is a report that states the percentage of smokers in the US by age. I was surprised that it was >20%.

[lockjaw02]

"Incidentally, I was surprised at the percentage of smokers in the US. Here is a report that states the percentage of smokers in the US by age. I was surprised that it was >20%."

That's what the particular folks who did that estimate say, but there is no way for them to get an accurate accounting as hard as they try. If you look for them, you'll also see many reports of a "new" phenomenon of the "occasional smoker", those who only smoke when out on the town. Many of those folks will never admit to being smokers on typical surveys.

However, there are some pretty comprehensive reports out there, many on the CDC site, that show the pure numbers of smokers as being fairly consistent 50 million over the past 40-50 years, with dips or rises of a few thousand or so. With population growth, the percentages have been steadily falling. In 1998, the CDC reported that 24.1% of adults in the US were cigarette smokers alone, not including pipe and cigar smokers.

But there is no accurate way of coming up with accurate numbers because of too many confounders. Some smokers don't admit it, because of reasons such as stigma, health insurance, or because smokers are now being denied jobs. The field day governments are having with jacking up taxes is driving some of the market to bootleg, untaxes sources, so counting cigarettes isn't accurate either. Perhaps they can try to validate by counting tobacco quotas, shipments, manufacturing numbers, but again, tobacco is an international trade and blackmarketing and smuggling to evade obscenely high tax rates abound.

However you slice it, there are still significant numbers of smokers out there even though the anti-smokers keep claiming their tax, restrict, humiliate, denormalize, dehumanize, and demonize campaigns are reducing rates. A little critical skepticism will indicate that they are in the business of selling their business to keep their paychecks flowing. So you have to look hard, and read between the lines to get the most accurate estimates possible.

[Little John]

Do either of you know the name(s) of the smokeless casinos that failed ? I just can't conceive that anyone in their right mind would front (bet) their money to establish a smokeless casino. Most of the big places have non-smoking slot sections and even a few ns tables but a completely NS casino is just plain insane.

[WaterDragon]

From the statistics I have read, the smoker's predominate the lower income brackets

That is pure propaganda. There are plenty of smokers among the rich and famous, cigarettes as well as cigars.