[Gunrunner2]

>>Incidentally, whenever I think of PTSD after Vietnam I think of the first "Rambo" film. He solved his problems in a somewhat destructive manner. <<

Here’s a clue. . .Rambo was a MOVIE, fiction. LOL. . .can’t tell the difference, can you?

>>The problem's not new: in your Civil War it was called "nostalgia". It's also been known as "shell shock", "battle fatigue" and "paranoid schizophrenia". <<

It is not new and you make my point. It has been recognized and dealt with, sometimes well, sometimes not, but in all cases we recognize the symptoms and are prepared to deal with it when it is REQURIED. Oh, and we in the US did not shoot anyone for battle fatigue (didn’t the British Army do that to some poor sap in WWI?).

>>I remember reading about many homeless drifters after the Civil War, and about loners living in the wild after Vietnam. <<

And. . .so what? What the heck does that have to do with anything?

Civil War veterans were out to make a life for themselves, many moved west and settled this country. . .a risky and dangerous effort. They were honest, hardworking, innovative, brave and certainly not adverse to standing up to tyranny. Anytime you see some western movie where some bad guy has the town scared, think again; likely the banker and shopkeeper and the average citizen were veterans of the Civil War, as well as Indian wars, and would not stand for such nonsense.

As far as Vietnam goes, Jimmy Carter is to blame for the “homeless” wanderers. Jimmy’s administration emptied the nut-houses because being nuts isn’t a reason to incarcerate someone against their will, and merely being homeless doesn’t mean they are a threat to anyone. See?

So, he dumps the very people lefty nut-burgers want to “help.” And, by the way, the numbers of supposed PTSD “veterans” from the Vietnam War are exaggerations. It is fashionable for lefty nut-burgers to claim Vietnam Veteran status to a) get sympathy, and b) blame others for their poor choices. If they were true veterans they could get help immediately from any VA hospital.

>>In Germany the phenomenon was familiar but not spoken of. After WW1 it was manifested in old-soldiers' clubs with a tendency to political violence.<<

Here’s another clue. . .we ain’t Germany (thank God)

>> Adolf Hitler is a classic example of a PTSD sufferer who projected his fears to politics. <<

Just where do you “feel” you are going with this? Sheesh, your logic is stunning in its confusion.

>>WW2 ended differently, so the symptoms differed too. A neighbour's friend is still jittery and "wussy" after being buried alive in a trench or something in Russia. <<

Pay attention: Forcing every man to undergo PTSD counseling/analysis is an attempt to wussify every man that ever served in combat. My father-in-law was one of 9 of his platton to survive and he was jittery around loud noises all his life. He dealt with it. He didn’t cry and whine and run to some stick-boy Oprah-Clinton-I-Feel-Your-Pain idiot. He lived his life. He wasn’t a wussy.

>>There's also a tendency to be somewhat timid and unwilling to face up to conflict. <<

Speak for yourself. And that doesn’t track with what you said earlier about PTSD contributing to confrontation and violence—the Hitler and violent charges above are contradictions to your point. Be consistent, please.

>>All the ex-Wehrmacht men I have met have been EXTREMELY anti-war and left-leaning.<,

That’s just Germany and an aberration and a departure from their history and heritage.

>>There were in any case far too many sufferers to be treated, they had to work it out themselves. <<

Funny how many actually did just fine.

>>The suicide figures for British Falkland War veterans (no "wussies" they!) are also not encouraging for the do-nothing approach. <<

Got source data to show they are anything less or more than the average for their age and demographic? Bet not.

>>I agree that pyschologists aren't always the answer, it's often the individual personality that counts most.<<

They (psycho-stick-boy therapists) are the LAST answer I’d look for. Self-RESPECT counts more than any amount of self-esteem.

>> But you'd be well advised to keep an eye on Iraq veterans, if only for their families's sake. <<

A variation of the ol Clinton and liberal “it’s for the chilllren” And in this case it’s for the familes. I’m gonna hurl.

Get a grip, get a life and grow up. Men are men and we have enough support groups/organizations/counselors/hand-holding stick-boys to go around. And now we have you.

From now until the last veteran dies we shall hear from you and others of a, say, liberal bent that anytime a Iraq War veteran does something illegal or violent, “it MUST be the war. It must be PTSD!”

>>But whatever, they're your soldiers, not mine.<<

Thank God for that.

[ukman]

>Here’s a clue. . .Rambo was a MOVIE, fiction. LOL. . .can’t tell the difference, can you? <

Sure it's fiction, but sometimes fiction is based on fact.

>It is not new and you make my point. It has been recognized and dealt with, sometimes well, sometimes not, but in all cases we recognize the symptoms and are prepared to deal with it when it is REQURIED. Oh, and we in the US did not shoot anyone for battle fatigue (didn’t the British Army do that to some poor sap in WWI?).<

MANY poor saps.

>Civil War veterans were out to make a life for themselves, many moved west and settled this country. . .a risky and dangerous effort. They were honest, hardworking, innovative, brave and certainly not adverse to standing up to tyranny. Anytime you see some western movie where some bad guy has the town scared, think again; likely the banker and shopkeeper and the average citizen were veterans of the Civil War, as well as Indian wars, and would not stand for such nonsense.<

Here’s a clue. . .westerns are MOVIEs, fiction. LOL. . Can’t tell the difference, can you? :-)

I see you don't believe in PTSD affecting Americans. Fair enough, there's no problem then. Whether Vietnam vets are scroungers or not or whether they are combat vets... well that's not for me to say.

Re. Adolf and Germans. No inconsistency: PTSD affects different people different ways. It makes some aggressive, some timid, some a strange mixture of the two. I don't see any contradiction. I didn't say PTSD made Hitler what he was. But WW1 certainly affected him deeply. Ultimately he got over it too. As regards ex-Wehrmacht men being an aberration, I bow to your superior knowledge of this country.

I can't be bothered to look up about Falklands vets: I just recall reading articles years back about problems with them. A Google search could turn up something, I suppose.

As regards looking after your own returnees; if you're sure there's no problem, who am I to gainsay you? You live in the USA, not me.

>Get a grip, get a life and grow up. Men are men and we have enough support groups/organizations/counselors/hand-holding stick-boys to go around.<

Pleased to hear it.

>And now we have you.<

No you don't. I was just offering a few thoughts on the matter to perhaps provoke an intelligent debate, rather than just get insulted. Like I said, I'm British, interested in all sorts of things, but not an expert. And yet again, it's not really my concern...

Tell you what, just ignore my post if you don't like it. Have a nice day!