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Scientists Show We've Been Losing Face For 10,000 Years
The Times (UK) ^ | 11-20-2005 | Jonathan Leake

Posted on 11/20/2005 1:21:49 PM PST by blam

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To: ValerieUSA
People with more refined favial features may be more attractive to the opposite sex and therefore more successful breeders. That's not evolution.

Natural selection changing the genes that get inherited, regardless of cause or motivation, is one of the two key components of evoluation. The other, of course, is genetic change (the source or cause of which is mathematically irrelevant.)

21 posted on 11/20/2005 1:39:34 PM PST by sourcery (Either the Constitution trumps stare decisis, or else the Constitution is a dead letter.)
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To: SmoothTalker

No it isn't ... preferential breeding does not change one species into another.


22 posted on 11/20/2005 1:40:17 PM PST by ValerieUSA
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To: blam

Humans with large faces to humans with small faces is not evolution, just variations within a species.


23 posted on 11/20/2005 1:42:31 PM PST by PioneerDrive (Don't fence me in.)
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To: martin_fierro

I think Blam and Sunken Civ will have a better clue about those ancient artifacts than I.


24 posted on 11/20/2005 1:42:46 PM PST by Fierce Allegiance (Talk about mixed emotions - last NASCAR race of the year.)
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To: sourcery

Wouldn't that be more specifically Darwin's "sexual selection", rather than the more general "natural selection"?


25 posted on 11/20/2005 1:42:55 PM PST by Zeppo
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To: ValerieUSA

If faces change to a softer shape--I think it might have to do with the male attraction to childlike faces. Hardwired for the fecund and the nubile--and might go a long way towards explaining the intractability of the seduction of the adolescent. Yet again, in this article, the muddling-up of selection for type and "evolution."


26 posted on 11/20/2005 1:43:23 PM PST by Mamzelle (.)
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To: sourcery

That does not explain the "evolution" of bacteria changed into a variety of fish changed into a variety of mammals....


27 posted on 11/20/2005 1:43:55 PM PST by ValerieUSA
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To: ValerieUSA

Isn't the idea that prefered breeding over an extended period of time (i.e hundreds of thousands or millions of years) creates a new species?


28 posted on 11/20/2005 1:44:19 PM PST by SmoothTalker
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To: blam

-PJ

29 posted on 11/20/2005 1:44:40 PM PST by Political Junkie Too (It's still not safe to vote Democrat.)
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To: sourcery

ID deniers will have a hard time attacking this.

Face shrinkage here has nothing to do with survival, imo. Much with politics and sin, imo...like the Chinese not marrying girls with big feet....though I do like those hungarians and people with narrow eyes look crosseyed stupid, imo.

To me it seems, in any case, that it has nothing to do with survival, but an appropriate fit to a more graceful life, something Darwinism rejects as a factor....well, they do have fixes such as motherly instinct and looks for survival...but this goes into a realm that is much more subjective, imo.


30 posted on 11/20/2005 1:44:58 PM PST by JudgemAll (Condemn me, make me naked and kill me, or be silent for ever on my gun ownership and law enforcement)
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To: ValerieUSA
"People with more refined favial features may be more attractive to the opposite sex and therefore more successful breeders. That's not evolution."

That's the essence of evolution.

31 posted on 11/20/2005 1:45:22 PM PST by Oblongata
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To: SmoothTalker
"People with more refined facial features may be more attractive to the opposite sex and therefore more successful breeders. That's not evolution."

"I don't buy everything about evolution personally, but you just gave a text book definition of the theory.

Choosing a mate because she has a pretty face is natural SELECTION, NOT "evolution".

32 posted on 11/20/2005 1:49:16 PM PST by manwiththehands
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To: blam
Changes in diet are thought to be the main cause. The switch to softer, farmed foods means that jawbones, teeth, skulls and muscles do not need to be as strong as in the past.

Seems to carry a hint of Lamarkian Evolution.

33 posted on 11/20/2005 1:49:58 PM PST by ClearCase_guy
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To: Zeppo

Darwinists claim that good looks suppresses your immune system, and, thus, those surviving with good looks must be very strong in immunity. Eg. the peacock with the biggest feathers gets chosen coz that's the strongest who can fight the immune supression best.

However, let us not confuse Darwinism and materialism, ie. as in materials precede thought etc...

Many materialists have hijack darwinists and used them for their own Marxist political purposes...and FR reeks with such.


34 posted on 11/20/2005 1:50:42 PM PST by JudgemAll (Condemn me, make me naked and kill me, or be silent for ever on my gun ownership and law enforcement)
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To: blam

Not everyone gets wisdom teeth? Rats, why was my family so unlucky, we've paid a fortune to have them removed from ourselves and our children.


35 posted on 11/20/2005 1:51:16 PM PST by pepperdog
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To: blam

women might have looked more like Camilla [the Duchess of Cornwall]. >>>

Or more accurately like her horse.


36 posted on 11/20/2005 1:52:15 PM PST by Appalled but Not Surprised
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To: Oblongata
It feeds the myth, I guess--though I can show you more interesting things that have happened with the simple breeding of livestock over thousands of years, in geo isolation, (over geo time!)--without any evolution at all.

Unless you mean that evolution means selection for type? I've been given lots of vocabulary by evos in the attempt to bridge all these uncomfortable, contingent gaps between the species..Evos make so many assumptions--round faces do not new species create.

37 posted on 11/20/2005 1:53:24 PM PST by Mamzelle (.)
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To: Oblongata

No, it isn't.


38 posted on 11/20/2005 1:54:29 PM PST by ValerieUSA
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To: blam
The shrinkage has been blamed for a surge in dental problems caused by crooked or overlapping teeth.

Stopped reading when I got to this second sentence.

The surge in dental problems is because the last 10,000 years our face has changed?

Why didn't our teeth adapt also???

39 posted on 11/20/2005 1:54:45 PM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Mamzelle
"What does GGG stand for? My first thought would be Gravytrain Grant Grubber."

It stands for Gods, Graves and Glyphs, an archaeology - anthropology and ancient history ping list.

40 posted on 11/20/2005 1:55:11 PM PST by blam
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