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Here it comes again. Raising the specter of Venus and Mars. Venus and Mars both are significantly different than Earth. Venus appears to have went through a period of intense volcanism and it has completely been resurfaced. It is not known what caused this but whatever did it most surely could not be attributed to a minuscule increase in CO2. Something truly disastrous happened to Venus and it wasn't the simpleton's view of a race of Venusians cooking their planet with CO2.

Mars on the other hand is much smaller than Earth and has a much thiner atmosphere. More sunlight gets through but it is farther away from the sun so receives less than half the sunlight that Earth does at the surface and it has less clouds to trap the energy which makes it very cold.

Mars currently is going through a Global Warming of its own and it would be interesting to see if Venus has also had an increase in temperature. If all the planets are showing an up tick there may be a reason to believe that an outside factor namely the sun is responsible for much of the warming. (It was hard to keep a straight face writing that) No, the sun responsible for warming? Now get the hell out of here! lol

The one thing that we do know is that the Earth has been significantly warmer in the past. So much so that no ice caps existed at the poles and we did not face a run away green house effect. Earth has also underwent extreme levels of volcanism and that didn't do it either. Earth has been hit by extinction level impacts from space and that didn't trigger a run away green house effect. If those things didn't do it we certainly aren't going to. We may wipe ourselves out and even most of the life on the planet (though I doubt that) but Earth will recover and survive as if we never existed at all.

1 posted on 04/30/2007 7:57:27 AM PDT by Maelstorm
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To: Maelstorm

All that manufacturing on Venus and Mars sure f***ed them up!


2 posted on 04/30/2007 7:59:14 AM PDT by Chi-townChief
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To: Maelstorm

I guess those Martian and Venusian SUVs were very active 5 billion years ago...


3 posted on 04/30/2007 7:59:27 AM PDT by JRios1968 (This tagline brought to you by courtesy of Happygrl)
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To: Maelstorm

It is still President Bush’s fault!


4 posted on 04/30/2007 8:01:42 AM PDT by BillT
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To: Maelstorm
Premise #1: Climate of Venus suffered catastrophe millions of years ago, and the planet lost it's water. Using advanced computer models, scientists are discovering that climates are much more complicated than they had thought.

Premise #2: Climate of Mars suffered catastrophe millions of years ago, and the planet lost it's atmosphere. Using advanced computer models, scientists are discovering that climates are much more complicated than they had thought.

Premise #3: The Earth has seen temperatures go up a degree or two over the last hundred years or so.

Conclusion: Mankind is destroying our planet through industrialization and we need to dismantle our economy and live in harmony with nature.

5 posted on 04/30/2007 8:06:05 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Enoch Powell was right.)
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To: Maelstorm
From what scientists know now, it is possible that Venus and Mars started out a lot like Earth.

Simply a lie. We do not know how either Venus or Mars started. Just another GW pantload.

6 posted on 04/30/2007 8:06:13 AM PDT by pabianice
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To: Maelstorm
I don't get it.

Were there SUVs on Mars and Venus?

7 posted on 04/30/2007 8:10:36 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Islam is a religion of peace, and Muslims reserve the right to kill anyone who says otherwise.)
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To: Maelstorm

People who don’t believe in “martian-made” and “venetian-made” global warming are no different than Holocrust deniers.


9 posted on 04/30/2007 8:14:24 AM PDT by almcbean
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To: Maelstorm
First the authors say that the planets heated up becuase of the sun.

Then they say:

"As Earth warms in response to manmade pollution, it risks the same fate."

If the warming before was caused by the sun - why is it such a stretch to think that it may be this time also?

10 posted on 04/30/2007 8:14:27 AM PDT by Tokra (I think I'll retire to Bedlam.)
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To: Maelstorm

This isn’t so complicated.

Venus is too close to the sun.

Mars is too far from the sun.


15 posted on 04/30/2007 8:42:56 AM PDT by OK
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To: Maelstorm

“Water vapour is a powerful greenhouse gas and it caused the planet to heat-up even more. This is turn caused more water to evaporate and led to a powerful positive feedback response known as the runaway greenhouse effect”

OK. So how in the world did the Earth recover from the balmy days of the dinosaurs, when there were no icecaps and the oceans were apparently well over 100 deg. F in places? There was absolutely a LOT more H20 in the atmosphere then...

(Possible hint: There is no such thing as 101% humidity.)


16 posted on 04/30/2007 8:45:21 AM PDT by PreciousLiberty
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To: Maelstorm
What now?

Conservative Capitalist Christian Republicans are responsible for Galactic and Universal Warming?

17 posted on 04/30/2007 8:48:30 AM PDT by TexasCajun
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To: Maelstorm
What happened on these two worlds is very different but either would be equally disastrous for Earth.

Arguably all three planets are equally subject to the effects of a single cause, solar heating. So why, in the case of Earth, do we insist that human activity is the principle cause of climate change? Jeepers, it appears that Jupiter and even Pluto have heated up in fairly recent times -- that is, at a time when solar activity has been off the scales....

Of course, there's not much science can do about solar activity: We just have to grin and bear it.

Of course, to acknowledge that fact doesn't provide much of a rationale for applying for a research grant geared to "fixing" global warming!

It seems we need to be doing more research on the sun....

Thanks for posting this, Maelstrom!

20 posted on 04/30/2007 8:58:07 AM PDT by betty boop ("Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." -- A. Einstein.)
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To: Maelstorm; y'all
The more scientists look at those equations, the more they realise just how complicated Earth's climate system is. Grinspoon puts the predicament like this: "In fifty or a hundred years, we will know whether today's climate models were right but if they are wrong, by then it will be too late."

In fifty or a hundred years, we will know whether taking today's climate models to make political decisions restricting freedoms were right; -- but if they are wrong, by then it may be too late to restore our liberties.

21 posted on 04/30/2007 9:02:40 AM PDT by tpaine (" My most important function on the Supreme Court is to tell the majority to take a walk." -Scalia)
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To: Maelstorm
Guillermo Gonzalez & Jay W Richards, The Privelged Planet: How Our Place in the Cosmos is Designed for Discovery
22 posted on 04/30/2007 9:02:44 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Maelstorm

Will the Ice Age Return?

The world is cooling — helped by man

Some scientists are convinced that the world’s climate is getting colder every year, threatening a return to the conditions of the last ice age, which reached its peak about 18,000 years ago.

[...]

From 1890 to 1940 worldwide temperatures rose about 0.18F every 10 years. Some animals extended their ranges northward, the sea was less frozen than before, and icebergs from Greenland did not penetrate as far south.

Since 1940 temperature has been dropping. According to a survey by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, the average ground readings for the northern hemisphere have, in the years from 1945 to 1968, fallen by one-half degree F. In the United States, east of the Continenal Divide, temperatures in the last decade averaged one to four degrees cooler than in the past 30 years.

-—page 69. Strange Stories, Amazing Facts
Published 1976, The Readers Digest Association
Library of Congress Catalog Card No. 76-2966

[The notion that cooling is being helped by man appears only in the subtitle of the article. Nothing in the article suggests how man might be accomplishing planetary cooling.]


25 posted on 04/30/2007 9:19:34 AM PDT by gcruse
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To: Maelstorm

What is the warming situation at Gliese 581?


30 posted on 04/30/2007 9:26:18 AM PDT by RightWhale (Repeal the Treaty)
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To: Maelstorm

We need a “Global Alarmist” superhero much like “Captain Obvious” to post with every “the sky is falling” article as they seem to be increasing in frequency during the latest media push on global warming.


31 posted on 04/30/2007 9:28:02 AM PDT by Gen-X-Dad
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To: Maelstorm

Catastrophe?

On worlds like Venus and Mars?

OH PLEASE.

Why stop there? Titan and Europa too!

Jeez man. They are extreme worlds because that is their natural state. It is not a “catastrophe” that Mars is Mars.


36 posted on 04/30/2007 9:56:08 AM PDT by Names Ash Housewares
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To: Maelstorm
From what scientists know now, it is possible that Venus and Mars started out a lot like Earth.

Guess those Venusians and Martians didnt buy enough carbon offset credits. Bet they wish they had had their own Gorical!

38 posted on 04/30/2007 11:38:40 AM PDT by texson66 ("Tyranny is yielding to the lust of the governing." - Lord Moulton)
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To: 75thOVI; AFPhys; Alice in Wonderland; AndrewC; Avoiding_Sulla; BenLurkin; Berosus; Brujo; ...
from April.
 
Catastrophism
 
· join · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post new topic ·

41 posted on 05/20/2007 2:17:42 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Time heals all wounds, particularly when they're not yours. Profile updated May 18, 2007.)
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