Global Warming: No Match for the Coming Ice Age

The Skeptical Optimist ^ | October 8, 2007 | The Skeptical Optimist

[colorado tanker]

During the last ice age humans were driven into the southern U.S. In Europe, humans sheltered in refuges in southern Spain, Italy and the Balkans.

It will definitely be a challenge for the human race with much of the heart of the West and the world's financial institutions under the ice. A lot of arable land will be lost too.

I'm not sorry I won't see it.

[Freeport]

Here's the link to the History Channel Schedule: How the Earth was Made.

[muawiyah]

Depending on how we define an "interglacial", and recognizing that even the long period of glaciation comes in pulses of ice and interludes of less ice, we are probably 5,000 or so years OVERDUE!

Always remember to ignore the Younger Dyrass period. The greater part of the meltdown had already happened when a disaster came along, broke up and precipitously melted a large but otherwise residual ice sheet in Canada, and fostered yet another serious freeze in Europe and North America (through a variety of mechanisms).

So what is it that's holding the cold back?

Most likely agricultural practices, particularly irrigation, that warm the lower atmosphere and the soil.

This is only going to last so long and then we are going to be so far into the ice cycle that it'll just drop straight down on our heads in the Middle of the Super Bowl.

[Reily]

Didn’t Whitley Strieber publish a book in 1970s about how he went joy riding with aliens? ( and I am not talking about the kind that “do jobs Americans won’t do”!)

[Mrs. Don-o]

What is “very short order” in geologic terms?

[Reily]

not the 1970’s but in 1985 and the book was called “Communion”

[RetiredArmyMajor]

colorado tanker wrote: During the last ice age humans were driven into the southern U.S.

. . . . .

I guess that will mean fewer congressional seats in the northern states and more in the southern states.

[larryjohnson]

0800 tues

[colorado tanker]

LOL! Yep, look at the bright side, Barney Franks’ district will be under the ice!

[SeanOGuano]

I just bought my season ski pass at Snow Bowl. I’ve got a feeling it’s going to be a banner year!

[Sgt_Schultze]

bump

[jonrick46]

The documentary was good. It also talked about gamma-ray bursts. We have more to fear from gam­ma-ray bursts than global warming. Such occurs when stars collapse and become black holes. Such an event needs only to be about 8,000 light years away to cause major extinction from changes to the atmosphere. The production of nitric oxide from these atmospheric changes will destroy the ozone layer for years. It is this ozone layer that protects all life from cell killing ultraviolet radiation. Once nitric oxide is formed on the massive scale that such an event will create, it will take years for such a gas to absorbed into organic matter. The destruction of all surface-dwelling plankton will devastate the food chain for all sea life. Such a event has all ready occurred causing the Or­do­vi­ci­an Mass Ex­tinc­tion 450 mil­lion years ago.

The documentary described an extinction event that occurred 700 million years ago when the earth experienced a chill that created an ice layer—”Snowball Earth”—one mile deep. This event was caused by too little CO2 in the atmosphere which caused an ice layer to grow from the poles that reflected more and more sunlight and caused the Earth to get colder and colder. We could suddenly find ourselves in a CO2 death spiral where colder and colder temperatures cause less CO2 to be released from organic activities.

If a gamma-ray burst were to occur to knock out much of the earth’s CO2 organic matter, it could plunge the earth into an irreversible snow ball existence. We need as much CO2 kicking around in the atmosphere as we can to prevent an irreversible ice age.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Does lighting up the methane add or subtract from your carbon credits?"

Adds. Methane is a much stronger "warming gas" than CO2, so converting methane to CO2 would reduce the "greenhouse effect".

[ghost of nixon]

Conservatives need to launch a “Global Cooling Initiative”. To fight the inevitable onset of global cooling, we propose to do exactly nothing - unless liberals drop their projections of human-caused global warming to well below our projections of global cooling.

[Reeses]

Cooling down the earth would be tricker.

Clouds, snow, and ice crystals are mirrors, reflecting up to 95% of infrared back towards its source. Clouds and snow can be used to both heat and cool. We already make man-made clouds as a byproduct of factories, jet travel, and building water reservoirs. Even planting trees causes more water evaporation and therefore clouds. Just think if we made clouds on purpose.

The premise that mankind will not have a technology to prevent ice ages seems absurd. Compare the technology of 1907 with 2007 and note that the rate of technology advance is increasing. Earth will never again get too hot or too cold, will never be hit by another large meteor, and as long as we're around animal extinctions will be a thing of the past. It is very likely we'll bring many now extinct animals back to life.

All these doomsday scenarios neglect to factor that man is smart enough to change his environment to be whatever he wants it to be.

[SauronOfMordor]

There was a SF story from a while back (”Fallen Angels” Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle), set in a future where the environmentalists finally get CO2 emissions down to the point where they stop Global Warming — only to find out that was the only thing holding off the Ice Age

[arthurus]

The best way to prepare for an ice age is to take all the socialist restraints and government ropes off of the world’s economies. The Market is the best hope that technology will be developed to the point that humanity can cope. The more advanced is technology the more likely that humanity, or a portion of humanity will cope. The more Humanity tries to cope by giving government “emergency” or any other powers over the economy the less likely will be survival.

[arthurus]

The best way to prepare for an ice age is to take all the socialist restraints and government ropes off of the world’s economies. The Market is the best hope that technology will be developed to the point that humanity can cope. The more advanced is technology the more likely that humanity, or a portion of humanity will cope. The more Humanity tries to cope by giving government “emergency” or any other powers over the economy the less likely will be survival.

[RetiredArmy]

Doom, doom, doom; doomed doomed doomed doooooooo.

[RightWhale]

“very short order” in geologic terms?

Not intended to be in geological timescale, but generational. Flip could happen in twenty years or less. Maybe just one year without summer and away it goes.