"Gun free zones are free killing zones."
Posted on 12/17/2007 10:56:38 AM PST by neverdem
Unbelievable, indescribable, insane — miraculous; events at a missionary center and church in Colorado this week and at a mall in Nebraska the week before left people dumbfounded, angered and amazed. To face this during the season of peace adds to the desire to reach out to the victims, their families and these communities. Our hearts go out to them.
But we should look inward as well, and question how these events might influence our own lives — or laws.
Both of these killers were disturbed young men. Interior Alaska communities are small, and we mostly know each other, in some cases better than we’d like.
But who knows how many tragedies have been averted through people who cared before things went terribly wrong; a kind neighbor, extended family, a teacher, a coach, a foster parent or a volunteer. The importance of reaching out and listening never can be overstated.
But there is another aspect to consider that is of a more tactical nature.
In the Nebraska mall, where signs warned against carrying firearms, a young man walked in and killed eight and wounded five before killing himself.
He could have killed more.
In Colorado, the killer shot two people at a missionary center, returned home to post a hateful diatribe on the Internet and — armed with plenty of ammo and several firearms — killed four more at a church before a volunteer security guard shot him.
After the killings at Columbine and more recently at Virginia Tech, we all looked inward and wondered if the same sort of thing could happen in our own communities.
But a random shooting at a mall in Utah last Valentine’s Day — cut short by an armed off-duty policeman — is scarcely remembered even though five people were killed. In that case, the naturally modest hero was feted, and, well, it was easy to move on with a sigh of relief.
But this holiday season, a volunteer security guard — who was fired from her Minnesota law enforcement position and was praying for new direction in her life in a new town — was to become the hero. She saw news online of the shootings at the missionary school and had prayed for her own congregation before going to church. But the unbelievable happened, and she ultimately said she felt as if God steadied her hand as she stood to confront an enemy who held superior firepower and shot three times at her as she identified herself, shouted to the assailant to surrender and saved untold lives with the discharge of 10 rounds from her Beretta 9 mm.
Miraculous. Amazing.
This one is going to be a little harder to forget.
In Alaska, we have some of the most lenient concealed-carry laws in the country, but the law still prevents the possession of a firearm at courthouses, in school yards, bars and at domestic violence shelters. Many businesses also post signs or have in-house policies that disarm rule-following, law-abiding citizens.
And, really, does anyone think to bring their gun to church?
But consider what a volunteer security guard inside a Colorado church at Christmastime was called upon to do, and think about your own church, school or business. Should the state or businesses provide armed protection where citizens are denied the opportunity to protect themselves? Should the state be obligated to provide armed guards in schools or on college campuses if by law those areas are gun-free zones?
They are only questions to consider, but consider them we should.
"Gun free zones are free killing zones."
“Denial of reality is treason to the self.”
God bless the woman’s steady hand, and her 9mm Beretta. The word “hero” is thrown about generously these days, but she is a real hero.
I think you’re overarching.
“Should the state be obligated to provide armed guards in schools or on college campuses if by law those areas are gun-free zones?”
They would say that the police do that already. But obviously they don’t, do they? My cousin Daniel Rohrbough was killed at Columbine while the police waited outside the building. That kind of thinking will get others killed until we face up to the facts of human nature. There are worse things than having an armed society.
“as if she PREPARED for this ahead of time”
In fact the pastor contacted his volunteer security group (read that as his parishioners) when the perp killed people the day before to avoid a copycat killing. The church was justifiably concerned and did prepare before hand. Turns out that in colonial times, you were legally required to bring a gun to church, since the natives were smart enough to figure it was a good opportunity to attack colonists all together and unarmed.
What was that about?
Overarching? The guy that wrote the article is FACTUALLY incorrect on one count, and inconsiderate on another and *I* am “Overarching”?
How do you figure? Apparently you can’t see clearly or read?
Reading the thing as a whole I don’t see how you think this is an underhanded attack on Ms Assamm.
I’m not sure, but apparently he is at odds with the church because he’s been going to the media and stating how he berated another guard to “give me your gun” because the other guard apparently refused to do something. Then he stepped (he says) into the line of gun fire to “draw the attention” of the shooter, so Ms. Assam could take him down.
I saw another article posted here today that said he was escorted out by CSPD at the request of the church and the church is probably going to get a restraining order. Don’t know the rest of the story going on, just what was reported.
There’s a simple way to deal with businesses who want to ban the lawful carry of firearms on their premises.
As it is private property, they have the right to do so. However, many of them do it not just out of fear of firearms but also out of fear of liability lawsuits - they think that if something happens, they can point to their sign on the door and say “See, we didn’t permit this so we’re not responsible”.
So make the choice a lot simpler. Pass a law that says that any business that chooses to deny its customers and employees the right to lawfully carry arms for self defense on the property may do so. However, the business must then post large (3’x2’, in high-visibility black and white) signs at *every* entrance to their facility and again at every entrance to their building(s). The business must also provide an armed security guard at no charge to each and every person (that’s one guard per person) unless they specifically state that they do not wish such protection. Failure to do the first should result in large fines; failure or choice not to do the second should result in large fines compounded daily *and* total civil and criminal liability should a shooting incident occur on their property.
Now to compensate for this huge liability exposure, any business who *does* allow lawful carry and provides “normal” levels of security (for whatever region and industry) should be immune from civil or criminal liability if a shooting incident should occur on their property.
This is no more onerous than some OSHA or other such Federal regulations. And I should think that many businesses would jump at this.
Correct. Arms were usually stored in a corner of the church during services (we are talking flintlock muskets and rifles here).
Is this the man who was shot in the arm? I did hear from some reports - not knowing if true - that some of the security did freeze. Again, not corroborated by anything official that I've seen.
Yes, that man. I’m going on only the articles I’ve seen and the news reports he’s been interviewed on in the last few days.
He was hit in the arm, apparently the bullet grazed him. If he in fact jumped out to get the gunman’s attention off the woman trying to stop him, then he DID do a heroic thing.
As for asking the other guards to “give me your gun”, that’s just dumb. They were private citizens with concealed carry permits and personal weapons.
I don’t give up my gun for anyone, other than an authorized law enforcement official, and I sure am not handing it over to someone in the midst of a possible combat situation, whether HE thinks I’m right or not.
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