Posted on 12/16/2017 12:44:39 PM PST by GoldenState_Rose
“In the modern world, the decision is up to the woman herself,” Russia’s president said in his annual marathon press conference on Wednesday, which ran to just shy of four hours. Any attempt to suppress it, he added, would only push the practice underground, causing immense damage to women’s health.
Putin also cautioned against tightening the country’s historically liberal laws on abortion any further, saying that any decision on future regulation “must be careful, considered and based on the general mood in society and the moral and ethical norms that have developed in society.”
Putin’s comments—his first clear statement on the issue in 17 years of effectively uninterrupted rule—put a dampener on an increasingly vocal contingent of Russian society that is trying to restrict abortion. That movement, led in part by the Russian Orthodox Church, cites both the moral imperative of protecting unborn life, and the more pragmatic one of sustaining a national birth rate that slumped in the chaos that followed the collapse of the Soviet Union. Russia’s fertility rate dropped from 17 live births per 1,000 population in 1986 to only 8 by the year 2000.
It has crept up steadily since then and live births outnumbered deaths in 2015—for the first time since the collapse of the USSR...
The sight of Putin at odds with the church is all the more interesting as the former Communist has actively courted it for years to drum up support for a generally conservative social agenda.
...Russians have had a complex but often pioneering approach to the abortion issue. The Soviet Union was the first government in Europe to legalize it, (something it did as early as 1920), and the first country in the world to make it generally available through a state health care system free of charge.
(Excerpt) Read more at fortune.com ...
Murder of the most innocent.
No wonder Russia colluded with the Democrats.
Former KGB.
K illing
G estating
B abies
A nation as Russia facing demographic suicide should be as restrictive on abortions as humanly possible.
Agreed.
Due to the Putin regime’s stubborn mishandling of the economy (not to mention the poor state of the healthcare system) - even with financial incentives the State gives out to new mothers, Russians continue to opt out of having more children.
As in the U.S. the “pro-choice” thinking goes: it’s a bad time to restrict abortion when people are increasingly dissatisfied with deteriorating living standards.
Putin is unwilling to do the right thing on either the issue of Life or the economy (which would mean rooting out the corruption that keeps him in power)...
So true. Bizarre how the worst elements of communism linger even while the Marxist-socialist economics supposedly dissipated.
How does he square that with his public display of Orthodoxy?
A nation that authorizes mothers to murder babies is literally killing its own future.
Putin would have much better luck trying to move the Russian culture to embrace having large families. A “new cities” approach would help a lot.
That is, find some of the ‘garden spots’ in Russia and commission the building of the most “family friendly” city imaginable. Establish large paper-pushing government offices there, that is, centers for routine government paperwork.
Employment emphasis on young married men. Ideally, their wives are homemakers and bored. This is a recipe for a lot of kids.
Strict limits on alcohol, tobacco, drugs, and other adult entertainment. Have a good school system that emphasizes the teaching of history and patriotism.
The same way the majority of Russians do...which is to live in the tension of conflicting values in the name of political expediency or keeping the “peace.” Or in the name of preserving national pride. (Hence the willingness of many Russian Christians to celebrate the Soviet Union and even Stalin despite the enormous religious repressions which marked the 20th Century.)
Though, as the article points out - the Orthodox Church has put abortion (banning it at all stages of pregnancy) at the forefront of their social agenda. Not just for spiritual or moral reasons though: but to reverse the demographic decline.
At the moment, there is no Christian-values minded opposition to Putin in the Russian political scene.
And the Russian Orthodox Church relies on the State for much of its legitimacy and support. I don’t foresee them putting Putin to task anytime soon. It doesn’t help that a lot of the church’s leaders are too, former KGB...
Abortion is murder. Women who contract for the murder of their children should be locked up, if not given the death penalty. ‘Doctors’ too. A little of that, and abortion would come to a halt.
Do you expect him to burn down abortaries and hang abortionists?
Abortion culture in Russia is deeply entrenched and has a history dating back to hundred years ago.
That is important is a steady decline in abortions other last decades and government policies has a lot to do with that.
Do you want it to change overnight by some violent way? You’d yourself claim it is barbaric which is a typical lefty tactics.
Kinda remind me a liberal blog on YouTube with the same commenter putting Russia in two separate ‘top 10 worst’ lists one being for women rights and another for religious freedom. In the first case the issue was a genital mutilation practice existing in Dagestan and the latter ‘attempted crackdown on Islam in Dagestan’. LOL.
That is how you libs see things.
As a Russian (heavily leaning toward pro-life position) I am very much agree with Putin on this topic. This question is of a strategic importance and should be approached from a strategic perspective. It means - slowly, incrementally, and with very defty touch. Which is actually being done. I’ll put here a translation of Art. 56 of Russian federal law # 323-FZ of 11/21/2011 “On foundations of healthcare in Russian Federation”. Article is named “Artificial termination of pregnancy”. I’ll place it here with my comments and follow-up summary of the situation as it is now.
“Article 56. Artificial termination of pregnancy.
1. Every woman is to decide the question of maternity on her own will. Artificial termination of pregnancy is conducted by request of a woman and with informed voluntary consent of a woman. (COMMENT - This consent form is estabilished by the order of the Ministry of Health first time in 2007, Order # 335, where this form was a mere few formal lines of warning without any specifics. However in 2016 this order was replaced by Order #216N which estabilished a far more detailed and grimly colourful warnings in the consent form, listing off most severe possible side effects of abortion. It clearly is crafted to get on the nerves of a woman, besides the purpose of shielding the doctors from lawsuits)
2. Artificial termination of pregnancy by request of the woman can be conducted if the pregnancy term does not exceeds 12 weeks (COMMENT. If I remember correctly, US terms for this is about 20+ weeks or more, based off autonomy principle, estabilished by SCOTUS. Far more conservative approach. Also, notably absent is stipulation that abortion is conducted within confines of mandatory state health insurance programs, which was present in previous law, i.e, there is no direct stipulation that this operation should be state-funded. It is still is (as there is another law, detailing contents of this prorams, but recently there was a push (so far not much traction but who knows) to exclude abortion from it - and it would be a lot easier done without contraditing stipulatiion in this foundation law.).
3. Arificila termination of pregnancy is conducted:
1) no sooner than 48 hours after request made by a woman to medical organization is recieved:
a) if pregnancy term are between 4th and 7th week,
b) if pregnancy term are between 11th and 12th weeks, but before the end of the 12th week.
2) no sooner than 7 days after request made by a woman to medical organization is recieved if pregnancy term is between 8th and 10th week. (COMMENT. Previous law, enacted in 1993, in effect up until late 2011 had no stpulation on such “think over it again” periods).
4. Arificial termination of prenancy for social resons can be conducted if pregnancy term does not exceed 22 weeks, and for medical reasons - irrespective of pregnancy term.
5.List of social reasons for artificial termination of pregnancy is estabilished by Government of the Russian Federation. (COMMENT. As of now said list includes ONLY rape-induced pregnancies. And here I will demonstrate a clear trend. List first estabilished in 1996 (Govermental decree # 567 included 13 positions such as: severe disability or death of a husband, woman or husband being sent to prison, woman or her husband are certified as unemployed, woman being stripped of or restricted in parental rights by court, woman not in marriage, divorce during pregnancy, rape-induced pregnancy, absence of secure housing, woman with a refugee or displaced status, woman already have 3 or more children, woman raising a child with disability, incom,e per family member are below estabilished regional minimum. This list was declared void in 2003 (decree # 485) New list was radically shorter and included only those: woman stripped of or restricted in parental rights by court, woman (but not husband) being in prison, rape-induced pregnancy, severe disability or death of a husband during pregnancy. This list, in turn was declared void in 2012 (decree #98) and left only one position - rape induced pregnancy.I think the trend is evident. Severe noose-tightening.)
6.List of medical reasons for artificial termination of pregnancy is estabilished by relevant federal authority (COMMENT. Ministry of Health Order # 736 of 2007 includes either life-threatening conditions (like active tuberculosis or severe psyhical disorders).
7. For a woman of full legal age who was in accordance with law acknowledged as legally incompetent or partially competent, if she is unable to clearly state her will, arificial termination of pregnancy could be conducted only on grounds of court decision, which is rendrered if her legal representative file a plea with court, and on condition of said woman participation in the proceedings.
8. Illegal execution of artificial termination of pregnancy is subject to administrative or crriminal punishment in accordance with law.
CLOSING COMMENTS AND CONCLUSION.
This piece of legislation and follow-ups on it demonstrates incremental stiffening of the state’s stance on abortion, but it is very deft, non-highprofile. In addition to the stiffening, there is other inderect measures to dissuade women from abortion such as maternity capital (very hefty sum of money (at least outside St. Petersburg or Moscow) paid by the state in case of birth of a second (and for every after second) child. Could be used for mortgage, buying home, education for kids, etc. Released in parts, strictly watched over to avoid misuse. As of several weeks back Putin suggested (and Parliament agreed) to estabilish monthly payments to parents for duration of 1.5 years for the firstborns. Not much (about 350-400 dollars) but it will surely will help cover daily expencesof raising a child. Children-aimed self-development infrastracture is sprawling up too (giving future parents some hope that their kid would be pursuing his dreams instead of roaming streets aimlessly). Big enough support for families with a lot of kids (free land, car and susidies in other areas, etc.). All this is hampered by bureaucracy to a point of course, but it is happening.
My conclusion is this^ Putin and his government want to side-step the abortion ban problem, instead, making abortion maximally unappealing, making the current laww effectivel dead one, since nobody (or almost nobody) would use it. And I am perfectly in agreement that outright ban is unacceptable. Political reasons aside, thwere is a saying that prohibited fruit is sweet. Ban would sway people in the gray zone towards possibly ignoring it on principle. Better make it unappealing. Besides, ban would lead to black market of illegal abortions (inevitably) which wold lead to increased female death rates. depriving country as a whole of reproductive capacity even in potential. Plus, increased spending on law enforcement to keep tabs on this black market and try to control it. This money would be better spent promoting and supporting maternity - which is being done. Ban is a testament to a saying that every problem has obvious, simpe, INCORRECT solution. Tacling the probl;em from the opposite end is more productive.
So Putin is HARDLY pro-choice CHAMPION. He just works in the opposite direction like he used to - that is, covert.
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