Posted on 10/23/2009 9:47:41 PM PDT by SmithL
Tears twinkled in Barbara Schmidt's eyes as she spoke of her church's decision to sever ties with the Evangelical Lutheran Churches of America.
"I feel like we are now looking at the Bible as gray instead of black, like it is," she said, her voice breaking with emotion.
Schmidt, a member of Zion Mission Valley Lutheran Church, was raised in the congregation her family helped establish. She was baptized when she was two weeks old by a minister who rode to her grandparents home on horseback.
"I feel like we all have a purpose, and I think we're getting weighted down with politics," she said. "Why can't we just love one another and just live like the Bible says?"
Oct. 31 marks Reformation Day, a Lutheran observance to commemorate Martin Luther's posting of the 95 Theses and the start of the Protestant Reformation in Germany.
Now, the Mission Valley church, a 348-member congregation, will be involved in a reformation of their own. One that will make them the first in the Southwest Texas Synod to act.
The decision follows an August vote by the ELCA general assembly regarding human sexuality. The vote allows for churches who wish to do so to "recognize, support and hold publicly accountable, lifelong, monogamous, same-gender relationships."
A separate resolution also addressed finding a way for people in those relationships to serve as rostered leaders.
Zion Lutheran voted Sept. 6, by a 95 percent margin, to sever ties with the ELCA. The vote is the first of two that must happen for the church to formally leave the denomination.
"It has to do much less with pastors than it does with the fact that it says that we can do what scripture says is not OK," said the Rev. David "Mike" Couchman of Zion Lutheran. "We're not losing them. They've already left us and Lutheranism in the process."
The church is searching for a new Lutheran association to join and expects to choose one on Nov. 1, said Henry Wood, the church council president. They have until December to do so.
The decision entails more than just theology. The church must also consider pastoral pension plans, nonprofit status and the role of women. The church must join another recognized Lutheran association or they will lose their property to the ELCA, Wood said.
Zion Lutheran joins two others in the Southwest Texas Synod, who have decided to leave including St. Andrew, a 230-member church in Weesatche, and St. Paul Church in New Braunfels.
"It's sad for congregations to make decisions to leave the church body as strongly as they feel about it because there is opportunity for them to stay in the church," said Bishop Ray Tiemann, with the Southwest Texas Synod. "They're not compelled to have these resolutions in effect in their congregation. We have plenty of room to 'say we won't do that here.'"
Nationwide, church leaders are unsure how many congregations have begun the process to leave the denomination. In an informal count, the ELCA reports only six churches are in the process, including megachurch Community Church of Joy, a 5,000-member church in Glendale, Ariz., said John Book, ELCA spokesperson.
Jerry Wirtley, pastor of First English Lutheran Church in Victoria, believes the issue is much more widespread.
"There are meetings happening all over the place as to what churches will do," he said. "It is something that is to be discussed."
At Monday's meeting, there was a respectful dialogue of biblical theory, references to scripture and the consequences of Zion's action. Some members bit their nails and others fidgeted in pews as Tiemann announced what the church would be giving up by leaving the denomination.
His words did not sway the congregation's opinion.
"I'm not going to get emotional over it because if this church stayed, I'd probably leave," said Myrlene Diekhoff, a member who was present at the meeting. "He came to a congregation that's pretty well made up its mind and he didn't change my mind."
Nationwide, church leaders are unsure how many congregations have begun the process to leave the denomination. In an informal count, the ELCA reports only six churches are in the process,Yeah, only six.
It’s a shame they couldn’t vote the corrupt leadership out. But they are voting with their feet.
Militant gays take down another mainline Protestant church.
“Militant gays take down another mainline Protestant church.”
Yes, they destroyed the once great Episcopal church.
And Satan surely laughs at all of this, the small group of Faithful is being oppressed by those who prefer man’s praises to Christ’s
Do you think the Lutheran churches will come back to Rome too, like the Anglicans churches are doing?
Very sad. I am hardly an expert in Christianity but I think most people saw years ago the mainline Protestant denominations were pretty much doomed. The only exception might be the Baptist Church. I think the drift towards the left killed off the Episcopal or Anglican church first and the Methodists and Presbyterians are following along with the Lutherans.
The evangelicals have been taking people away from them because the mainlines had become liberal and possible stody for the young. I am not crazy about the evan rock concerts or the mega church properity preachers.
I think the churches that see the danger is Evangelicals, Baptists (hanging in there), this current Pope, Mormons and maybe a few others. Some may claim Mormons are not Christians but they are conservatives and understand the danger we are facing. I do not view Islam as a religion but an Arabic tribal political movement or cult.
Editorials in the UK are being written about the Pope moving in on the Church of England. Rowan Williams surrendered long ago and the Pope and Queen probably worried Williams was ready to surrender to Islam.
I think in the UK and in western Europe that the only branches of Christianity still alive are Catholcism and evangelicals. The leftist media has had a relentless campaign of demonizing Christianity.
Very sad.
1 Timothy 3:1-5, 13-16
1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. 13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.
“Militant gays take down another mainline Protestant church.”
‘Yes, they destroyed the once great Episcopal church.’
Maybe they just purified it. The more sincere Episcopals left for a more conservative Episcopal branch, right, the African Episcopal? I guess these moves are still in process. Hopefully, from my point of view, these ELCA folks who realize God doesn’t want practicing homosexuals in the pulpit, for heaven’s sakes, will re-align with such denominations as the Missouri Synod.
The gates of hell will not prevail. Satan tries to destroy, but the church always ends up being protected. Meanwhile the dross gets sloughed out.
“The more sincere Episcopals left for a more conservative Episcopal branch”
Yes, those who have been able to break away from the ECUSA, and joined the African Episcopal.
I was senior warden at the oldest Episcopal church in west Tennessee, built in 1832.
My last six years have been in strictly Roman Catholic countries, first in Slovakia, now in Philippines.
Ultimately, this is what people and churches are going to have to do... vote with their feet and wallets.
I disagree. If you look at the denominations that the gays have been able to get a foothold in, they have been smaller denominations. And their membership drops like crazy once the gays get into leadership and come out.
But the liberal gay MSM plays it up like it's all that is happening in Christianity.
If they take their false doctrine of ordaining women ministers with them, they will poison any group they associate with.
Baptists have been fairly stalwart in their orthodoxy but over the past 15 or 20 years I've noticed cracks forming that could spell trouble if not reined in firmly. My biggest beef with most Baptist (Southern)groups is the way they've recently fallen over themselves to embrace worldly interests and tactics - marketing, entertainment, teaching of psychobabble, etc. It's really sickening. Nothing different from the world, really.
One local example here in Texas is the Southern Baptist Convention's expulsion of a long-time Baptist Church that was becoming more and more liberal, even embracing the lie of the acceptability of homosexual conduct and relationships. The convention rightly expelled, but not without a lot of condemnation, both from without AND from within. The seeds of ungodly liberalism are already planted, even in the seemingly solid denominations.
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